Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

cowboyeagle05
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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 21 Jul 2021 15:08

The_Overdog wrote:It's nice to see hotel proposals moving again. I'm not aware of any that have been recently proposed in the areas I work, and of the ones I'm aware of that have been proposed in the past few years and zoning approved, none have broken ground.


Some might even say many new hotels have been a Dream not yet built...
“Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell”

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MrsKravitz
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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby MrsKravitz » 12 Jun 2022 12:42

Is anything happening with this lot? The dual branded hotels are dead but any word on the proposal for a new hotel here?

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rono3849
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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby rono3849 » 12 Jun 2022 13:34

dual.hiltons.jpg
dual.Hilton-Above.jpg


These renderings of the aborted dual Hilton hotels are a great reminder of the NIMBY crowds ability to kill a development. Now there's an empty lot, which will become a great dumping ground for debris, then they'll build a QT gas station. LOL.
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MrsKravitz
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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby MrsKravitz » 12 Jun 2022 21:45

What makes you think it was the neighbors? Was there opposition? I definitely thought it was due to the pandemic.
The property sold to a company that typically builds hotels, so I was inquiring about that project ( or lack of)

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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 14 Jun 2022 15:27

Last I saw the Oak Lawn committee said no cause they felt while burying the parking was a good plan that such a busy hotel with two flags on such small streets was too much they weren't willing to approve. The committee liked the project overall but supposedly Hall and Oak Grove are too small for such an active use.
“Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell”

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MrsKravitz
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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby MrsKravitz » 14 Jun 2022 16:05

cowboyeagle05 wrote:Last I saw the Oak Lawn committee said no cause they felt while burying the parking was a good plan that such a busy hotel with two flags on such small streets was too much they weren't willing to approve. The committee liked the project overall but supposedly Hall and Oak Grove are too small for such an active use.


Wow - I was not aware of that! Wonder what the current property owners will do with it now?

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R1070
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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby R1070 » 14 Jun 2022 18:39

This lot would be better suited for a condo or apt building.

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Dallas_Uptown
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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby Dallas_Uptown » 16 Jun 2022 12:51

MrsKravitz wrote:
cowboyeagle05 wrote:Last I saw the Oak Lawn committee said no cause they felt while burying the parking was a good plan that such a busy hotel with two flags on such small streets was too much they weren't willing to approve. The committee liked the project overall but supposedly Hall and Oak Grove are too small for such an active use.


Wow - I was not aware of that! Wonder what the current property owners will do with it now?


I'm a neighbor and can attest to the traffic issue...It's already a nightmare. I think a high-rise condo would be a much better fit.

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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 27 Jun 2022 15:38

Traffic is a nightmare at 6 pm everywhere and it's not at 11 pm in most places that will never go away.
“Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell”

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Kelley USA
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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby Kelley USA » 18 Jan 2023 13:43

This popped up just now on the TDLR....

https://www.tdlr.texas.gov/TABS/Search/ ... 2023009658

Here's the development company, with the project listed under current projects.

https://www.pdp-re.com/portfolio

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CTroyMathis
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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby CTroyMathis » 18 Jan 2023 13:47

I saw that, too, and was mildly surprised it was still a thing.

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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 18 Jan 2023 14:14

They just keep trying, but the whole argument before was that the neighborhood hated that much traffic on small neighborhood sized two-lane roads. I wonder if they will be able to get anything different. Last time they planned to bury all the parking so the towers were smaller but the OLC sided with the neighborhood which hated all the potential traffic from a hotel.
“Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell”

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R1070
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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby R1070 » 18 Jan 2023 15:21

I'm sure OLC already has their hands on the "NO!" button, but I think a Moxy would be a great fit for that area. Hopefully the developer pulls a Lincoln and just goes to the city if they start getting the run around. That's what the Dream Hotel developers should have done.

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Addison
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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby Addison » 19 Jan 2023 08:50

Can we please change the title for this thread, since it's now going to be dual-brand Marriott hotels (versus Hilton)?

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Kelley USA
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Re: Uptown: Dual Brand Hilton Tower / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby Kelley USA » 19 Jan 2023 09:21

Addison wrote:Can we please change the title for this thread, since it's now going to be dual-brand Marriott hotels (versus Hilton)?


Updated!

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CTroyMathis
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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project/ Oak Grove & Hall

Postby CTroyMathis » 19 Jan 2023 09:29

Yes, traffic must be of great concern near two cemeteries and a modest amount of density already there that somehow isn't already creating "traffic". Like they aren't the traffic. Where's my pool noodle.

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R1070
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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby R1070 » 19 Jan 2023 09:57

The Marriott on Fairmount is a hotel on a 2 lane street... They don't really have an argument here as the corner at Hall where this is proposed is less developed due to the cemetery and such.

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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby rogerroger » 19 Jan 2023 14:55

It seems like the new group avoided going through the OLC by designing the specs within the current PD-193. Can someone verify this? Looking back in December 2021, OLC rejected the similiar project & the group agreed to put all the parking underground. On the new TDLR submission, it looks like 6 of the 7 parking floors are above grade.

Here is the link to the OLC Dec 2021 meeting docs: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/14MKJ2vlCopQIGCqFbP3eTDAdAKudmOS0

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rono3849
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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby rono3849 » 19 Jan 2023 17:50

The area where this is proposed reminds me of some areas of San Francisco where there is no parking on the streets, which is what Dallas is going to have to do going forward. Uptown, Victory Park, & Harwood neighborhoods should all be no parking along streets. The area has changed and it's time to accommodate this new situation.

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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 20 Jan 2023 14:25

rogerroger wrote:It seems like the new group avoided going through the OLC by designing the specs within the current PD-193. Can someone verify this? Looking back in December 2021, OLC rejected the similiar project & the group agreed to put all the parking underground. On the new TDLR submission, it looks like 6 of the 7 parking floors are above grade.

Here is the link to the OLC Dec 2021 meeting docs: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/14MKJ2vlCopQIGCqFbP3eTDAdAKudmOS0


Yes, that's the funny thing the OLC, in that case, applauded the parking below ground, and the developer hoped that would get the other approvals as a trade-off. The OLC at that time decided the traffic complaints made by community members were just too much to ignore, so they denied the project. I think in that case, if they had decided to ignore the OLC and go to the council, they probably would have gotten approval, but I would expect city staff and council members would have told them behind closed doors if that was likely to get approved without the OLC's blessing. In this case, they are building what they can without changes cause, legally, they can do a lot without requesting variances. Sadly that means we will get a big butt garage above ground, but we will get a tax-generating dual-branded hotel despite some neighbors believing that traffic will ruin their small-town feel...
“Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell”

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rono3849
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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby rono3849 » 20 Jan 2023 17:13

Why would people expect a "small-town feel" to an area smack dab in the heart of one of the largest metropolitan areas in America? Who are these people? If you want to live in small town America, I'd suggest you move to Iowa or West Texas.

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Addison
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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby Addison » 20 Jan 2023 17:55

rono3849 wrote:Why would people expect a "small-town feel" to an area smack dab in the heart of one of the largest metropolitan areas in America? Who are these people? If you want to live in small town America, I'd suggest you move to Iowa or West Texas.


Exactly!

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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby mhainli » 21 Jan 2023 13:39

cowboyeagle05 wrote:
rogerroger wrote:It seems like the new group avoided going through the OLC by designing the specs within the current PD-193. Can someone verify this? Looking back in December 2021, OLC rejected the similiar project & the group agreed to put all the parking underground. On the new TDLR submission, it looks like 6 of the 7 parking floors are above grade.

Here is the link to the OLC Dec 2021 meeting docs: https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/14MKJ2vlCopQIGCqFbP3eTDAdAKudmOS0


Yes, that's the funny thing the OLC, in that case, applauded the parking below ground, and the developer hoped that would get the other approvals as a trade-off. The OLC at that time decided the traffic complaints made by community members were just too much to ignore, so they denied the project. I think in that case, if they had decided to ignore the OLC and go to the council, they probably would have gotten approval, but I would expect city staff and council members would have told them behind closed doors if that was likely to get approved without the OLC's blessing. In this case, they are building what they can without changes cause, legally, they can do a lot without requesting variances. Sadly that means we will get a big butt garage above ground, but we will get a tax-generating dual-branded hotel despite some neighbors believing that traffic will ruin their small-town feel...

Yes indeed, the OLC makes it even harder for a developer to do a quality development (and the local developers seem to have a hard time anyway). The OLC pats itself on the back by knocking off 5-10 stories from the heights of these developments and the developers can’t recoup costs for putting parking underground (and other niceties). So we get shorter blocky buildings with above ground parking. Yikes! Does OLC get this? Throughout OL, DT, etc. the FAA max determined height (already constrictive) should be the limiting factor.

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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby maconahey » 28 Feb 2023 14:32

Structure Type: High Rise/Sky Scraper
Structure Name: Uptown Dual Brand Hotel

Site Elevation:484
Structure Height: 320
Total Height (AMSL): 804

Work Schedule: 05/01/2023 to 04/30/2025


https://oeaaa.faa.gov/oeaaa/external/se ... 66&row=296


Site Elevation: 495
Structure Height: 300
Total Height (AMSL): 795

Work Schedule: 05/01/2023 to 04/30/2025


https://oeaaa.faa.gov/oeaaa/external/se ... 68&row=290

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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby rono3849 » 28 Feb 2023 18:33

dual.Hilton-Above (1).jpg


What a hideous development. This is straight off the exit ramp on Stemmons Frwy. on steroids. Ugly and unappealing. The best thing about it is that it is squatty and will be lost in the surrounding buildings in the neighborhood and hard to see from afar. Why can't we get appealing buildings in Dallas? No architectural style or flair.
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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby DFW » 28 Feb 2023 23:52

I agree, very bland, but it’s better than nothing.

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rono3849
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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby rono3849 » 01 Mar 2023 02:00

DFW wrote:I agree, very bland, but it’s better than nothing.


Actually, I'd go with nothing and just leave the plot of land open. When a company can't build a more less inspiring set of buildings, then just don't build it. This is beyond bland. It's plain ugly. I can't believe that Hilton would want to put their name on this monstrosity.

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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby eburress » 01 Mar 2023 06:26

It's doesn't wow me for sure, and obviously it's subjective, but I think it'll turn out better than the renderings suggest. For better or worse I think it'll be on par with the newish Marriott in Uptown on Fairmount and Carlisle.

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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby citygeek » 01 Mar 2023 07:07

Cheap and ugly. Oh excuse me, utilitarian. Dallas does beige and bland again. Dallas almost always does beige and bland. Yuk!
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R1070
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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby R1070 » 01 Mar 2023 08:39

eburress wrote:It's doesn't wow me for sure, and obviously it's subjective, but I think it'll turn out better than the renderings suggest. For better or worse I think it'll be on par with the newish Marriott in Uptown on Fairmount and Carlisle.

That's my thought as well. It's not in a high profile spot anyway and will most likely blend in with the surrounding buildings better.

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Kelley USA
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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby Kelley USA » 01 Mar 2023 10:22

I honestly don't mind it. My first impression was that it looks very similar to the Marriott as well. I think it'll actually turn out better than expected, if it gets built at all.

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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby Dragon_Lady » 01 Mar 2023 23:34

Wow…that’s some handsome 1960s Soviet bloc era architecture going on there! … set know wan heifer.

Architecture circa now is a middle finger to beauty.

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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby DBadger » 02 Mar 2023 08:47

I agree its not super impressive but I do prefer it to an empty lot. I am more interested in interaction at street level. Anything to improve walkability is welcome. Lived in Chicago for years, can't tell you what most of these buildings look like past the first and second floor.

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CTroyMathis
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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby CTroyMathis » 03 Mar 2023 13:38

rono3849 wrote:dual.Hilton-Above (1).jpg

What a hideous development. This is straight off the exit ramp on Stemmons Frwy. on steroids. Ugly and unappealing. The best thing about it is that it is squatty and will be lost in the surrounding buildings in the neighborhood and hard to see from afar. Why can't we get appealing buildings in Dallas? No architectural style or flair.


Not that the below visuals present something super fantastic, they aren't matching up with other renderings. Hard to even tell 100% that this is a current look.

Image

Image

Image

Image

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Dallas_Uptown
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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby Dallas_Uptown » 18 Apr 2023 15:57

I live across from the cemetery. Traffic is already abysmal.

But its growing on me.

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ajderry2017
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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby ajderry2017 » 31 Dec 2023 18:52

Any update on this? They were supposed to start in May. I see it’s still on the developers website

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R1070
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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby R1070 » 01 Jan 2024 02:28

I’ve seen some markers placed on the lot.

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Re: Uptown: AC & Moxy Hotel Project / Oak Grove & Hall

Postby rogerroger » 03 Jan 2024 13:02

I believe this project is dead for now. My friend knows the firm that was going to do the construction mgmt and admin on this project and their principals have moved on from this project. All the permitting was done but they can't get the loans/funding for the project.