DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)


cowboyeagle05
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 30 Sep 2021 10:15

Good to see another try at a independent coffee shop in Downtown even if its not as big as the Uptown location which is a gorgeous location.
“Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell”

cowboyeagle05
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 15 Nov 2021 08:50

If you wanna see the small space that White Rhino will be located in or the rest of the ground floor retail layout look no further than here.

https://shopcompanies.com/sites/default ... 1617116389
“Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell”

Tnexster
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Tnexster » 10 Oct 2022 12:02

New Chick-fil-A to open in downtown Dallas
Unlike many Chick-fil-As, this urban core store will not have a drive-through.

https://www.dallasnews.com/food/restaur ... wn-dallas/

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Cbdallas
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Cbdallas » 11 Oct 2022 11:19

This feels like such a strange fit for both entities but I guess rent is rent.

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Theluistorres
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Theluistorres » 11 Oct 2022 11:31

So are they just moving the one in the Renaissance tower into the national?

lakewoodhobo
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby lakewoodhobo » 11 Oct 2022 14:33

Theluistorres wrote:So are they just moving the one in the Renaissance tower into the national?


Correct. Past the paywall, it says the one in the food court is closing.

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IcedCowboyCoffee
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby IcedCowboyCoffee » 11 Oct 2022 14:36

I haven't stepped foot in that food court in over a decade... how's that place looking these days?

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Tivo_Kenevil
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 11 Oct 2022 17:08

IcedCowboyCoffee wrote:I haven't stepped foot in that food court in over a decade... how's that place looking these days?

COVID was not good for that place. I'm uncertain of it came bk.

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northsouth
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby northsouth » 11 Oct 2022 20:36

The restaurant stalls are all occupied (or at least not empty), and the Chick-Fil-A always seems to be doing great business.

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Cmacemm
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Cmacemm » 12 Oct 2022 11:50

Burguesa was where I always found myself at lunch when I worked down there. Is that place still open? It was so damn good

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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 12 Oct 2022 12:30

It still looks like a food court out of Stranger Things, but that's cause Renaissance Tower hasn't gotten major updates in a very long time which is why the new owners are planning to flip it mainly into residential. I am curious if they will touch their underground in any meaningful way or will leave it for another phase. I imagine the construction workers will keep it full during the redo above. The last time I was on an upper floor was for a Dallas County thing I can't even remember what, but the offices looked as depressing as a government office tends to be despite being in a large high rise covered in glass.

Getting Chick Fil A def seems like a big win as much as I love a good unique restaurant, we need casual places, too, and this spot was worth throwing at a chain restaurant to provide options for people who don't want to change what they get in Frisco, Plano, Garland, Mesquite, etc.
“Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell”

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Matt777
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Matt777 » 12 Oct 2022 18:28

I hope the tunnel restaurants make it, catering to office workers, while new street level restaurants/retail thrive focusing on residents and visitors. I think there's a place for both to exist.

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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 13 Oct 2022 12:03

It really depends on how many of these 80's office buildings survive cause they are the ones maintaining these mall food courts. I say go full throttle and make these food courts even more 80's like, with wandering teenagers and vintage fake storefronts from the golden era of malls to go with the food establishments.
“Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell”

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Tivo_Kenevil
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 13 Oct 2022 14:10

cowboyeagle05 wrote:It really depends on how many of these 80's office buildings survive cause they are the ones maintaining these mall food courts. I say go full throttle and make these food courts even more 80's like, with wandering teenagers and vintage fake storefronts from the golden era of malls to go with the food establishments.


Food courts should die. They're useless for most hours of the day.
As these old office buildings get turned into mixed use, so should these underground malls.

This offers a unique situation for the commercial owners to offer tons of new ammentinties to tenants. Think spas, arcade rooms, even changin' their use to hostels would be cooler than having access to shitty food court meals.

The food court idea has been tried for many years down there. Bring in new ideas. Time to adapt.

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Cbdallas
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Cbdallas » 13 Oct 2022 14:29

One of those larger areas underground could be turned into a fun bowling alley bar theme place with other games. Let all of it be turned into nightclubs underground with restuarants and stores moved to street level.

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Hannibal Lecter
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Hannibal Lecter » 14 Dec 2022 23:45

Very positive review of the hotel. But the reviewer (and commenters) don't think much of the neighborhood.

https://liveandletsfly.com/thompson-dallas-review/

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Matt777
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Matt777 » 15 Dec 2022 00:34

Hannibal Lecter wrote:Very positive review of the hotel. But the reviewer (and commenters) don't think much of the neighborhood.

https://liveandletsfly.com/thompson-dallas-review/


The write is from LA and he feels unsafe at in Downtown Dallas.... LOL. Rich. 90% of LA is a new campground for very aggressive and violent homeless people/unhoused persons. No comparison to DT Dallas at all. I have seen them throw glass bottles at children there. Please. This is just more Dallas hating, and the commenters are probably from the suburbs which are better DT-Dallas haters than even the NYC/LA crowd. DT Dallas is not perfect, but those in glass houses should not throw stones.

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sterling
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby sterling » 15 Dec 2022 03:22

I think the viewpoint is valid and not just hating. Dallas still lacks the streetlife that makes people feel safe. When you walk out of your hotel, look to the right and left. Which direction devoid of shops and restaurants should you take? With no tight-knit urban fabric,"luring" you to adventure to the next corner, you feel better in your glass cocoon.

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rono3849
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby rono3849 » 15 Dec 2022 10:03

I used to work at the old Dallas Times Herald, which was in that same general area. Except for the old Sanger Harris store, there was never much activity on the street in the area. All of the old style retail had been demolished for the newer buildings. I even remember when the Palace movie theater existed and there was at least some diversity to the urban core. Dallas became anti-septic when it destroyed much of its Downtown historical buildings that housed businesses thriving on street level retail. What little heart it had was ripped to shreds in the name of progress.

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I45Tex
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby I45Tex » 15 Dec 2022 14:44

There was too much money in office development to worry with small fry. Let alone out-of-date entertainment centers like cinema palaces.

Few of those successful businessmen and leaders could anticipate that small scale texture, serendipity and local character/creativity would become the buzzwords for the trophy tenants without which most of the most successful of them will go elsewhere to office. Even though that local flair stuff is currently popular, this is a cautionary tale about trusting the gut and resource deployment of the people who currently live successful careers in the community. There are plenty other things that deserve attention that they're not going to be paying attention to, and may be corrosive to, if we overvalue their skill and intuition.

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tamtagon
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby tamtagon » 15 Dec 2022 21:23

Word

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Matt777
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Matt777 » 15 Dec 2022 23:34

I never said Downtown Dallas was the epitome of street life, of course that can be worked on, but it should not be portrayed as an unsafe area. We are not going to attract the tourism, residents, and office tenants we need for more street life by telling people that a relatively safe area is unsafe.

Then when an area gets more lively and filled with pedestrian activity, those same people use a few incidents to claim an area is unsafe (ie Deep Ellum). From a safety perspective, I'd rather be in Deep Ellum any time of day, any time of night, than most of the urban core of Los Angeles lately.

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rono3849
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby rono3849 » 16 Dec 2022 00:06

Los Angeles has descended into a dystopian landscape of homelessness, filth, crime, grid lock traffic, & human despair. I lived there for 21 years and watched it sink into oblivion. I left in 2016. Friends still living there tell me it is a pure horror show now. Violence can occur anywhere at any time. The freeways are lined with encampments and tents. This why people and businesses are fleeing California in droves. It's a nightmare to circumvent on a daily basis.
Last edited by rono3849 on 16 Dec 2022 12:05, edited 1 time in total.

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Addison
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Addison » 16 Dec 2022 00:56

In all fairness, if we make an apples vs. apples comparison, downtown LA is definitely more vibrant than downtown Dallas (as someone else said, it has a decent amount of streetlife). Also, when I was there in 2019, the homelessness problem was mostly removed from the CBD.

All of that said, I also feel downtown Dallas right now is about where downtown LA was in the 80s and 90s, which was also relatively dead/sketchy. Hopefully, with the southern/eastern suburbs finally blowing up and the Convention Center project moving forward, we'll start to see more transformative mixed-use projects, residential developments & corporate relocations that will bring more life to DT over the next 10-20 years.

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tamtagon
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby tamtagon » 16 Dec 2022 06:36

If you don't want the problems that come with homelessness, then take care of the homeless; obviously, they cannot do it themselves.

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rono3849
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby rono3849 » 16 Dec 2022 12:13

tamtagon wrote:If you don't want the problems that come with homelessness, then take care of the homeless; obviously, they cannot do it themselves.


Los Angeles has thrown billions of dollars at the homeless situation and it has only gotten worse. BTW, Downtown LA was on the road to a major renaissance until the homeless decided to invade it. People have been attacked on the streets and crime is a huge problem. Many of the wonderful restaurants that had opened have shuttered. It's all very sad since judges have ruled in the homeless advocates favor of preventing encampments from being removed off public sidewalks and parks. When the plague returned, that didn't even give the authorities the power to clean these areas out. The world is upside down in California.

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Addison
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Addison » 16 Dec 2022 12:26

rono3849 wrote:
tamtagon wrote:If you don't want the problems that come with homelessness, then take care of the homeless; obviously, they cannot do it themselves.


Los Angeles has thrown billions of dollars at the homeless situation and it has only gotten worse. BTW, Downtown LA was on the road to a major renaissance until the homeless decided to invade it. People have been attacked on the streets and crime is a huge problem. Many of the wonderful restaurants that had opened have shuttered. It's all very sad since judges have ruled in the homeless advocates favor of preventing encampments from being removed off public sidewalks and parks. When the plague returned, that didn't even give the authorities the power to clean these areas out. The world is upside down in California.


For all we know, those downtown restaurants shuttering was largely due to LA's (and California's) draconian COVID restrictions, not the homeless situation. I saw nothing like what you describe in 2019 (pre-COVID) when I was in downtown LA.

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Tivo_Kenevil
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 16 Dec 2022 14:02

Addison wrote:
rono3849 wrote:
tamtagon wrote:If you don't want the problems that come with homelessness, then take care of the homeless; obviously, they cannot do it themselves.


Los Angeles has thrown billions of dollars at the homeless situation and it has only gotten worse. BTW, Downtown LA was on the road to a major renaissance until the homeless decided to invade it. People have been attacked on the streets and crime is a huge problem. Many of the wonderful restaurants that had opened have shuttered. It's all very sad since judges have ruled in the homeless advocates favor of preventing encampments from being removed off public sidewalks and parks. When the plague returned, that didn't even give the authorities the power to clean these areas out. The world is upside down in California.


For all we know, those downtown restaurants shuttering was largely due to LA's (and California's) draconian COVID restrictions, not the homeless situation. I saw nothing like what you describe in 2019 (pre-COVID) when I was in downtown LA.


I will be in LA for the holidays. I will report the current situation upon arrival good sir.

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JDumont146
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby JDumont146 » 16 Dec 2022 17:24

sterling wrote:I think the viewpoint is valid and not just hating. Dallas still lacks the streetlife that makes people feel safe. When you walk out of your hotel, look to the right and left. Which direction devoid of shops and restaurants should you take? With no tight-knit urban fabric,"luring" you to adventure to the next corner, you feel better in your glass cocoon.


This just isn't true. If you walk outside the Thompson (where i've stayed multiple times, and I walk these streets regularly), you can see typically a large amount of street life and many coffee shops, restaurants, businesses, etc. Specific examples directly outside of the building - White Rhino Coffee, Elm Street Cask and Kitchen, Starbucks, Sushiya, Fluellen Cupcakes, retail in the National, and you're within eyeshot of the Discovery Center Media Wall one block away. On the other side of the building is a very busy Dart stop. There are dead areas still in downtown, but this is definitely not one of them.

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potatocoins
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby potatocoins » 19 Dec 2022 15:22

JDumont146 wrote:This just isn't true. If you walk outside the Thompson (where i've stayed multiple times, and I walk these streets regularly), you can see typically a large amount of street life and many coffee shops, restaurants, businesses, etc. Specific examples directly outside of the building - White Rhino Coffee, Elm Street Cask and Kitchen, Starbucks, Sushiya, Fluellen Cupcakes, retail in the National, and you're within eyeshot of the Discovery Center Media Wall one block away. On the other side of the building is a very busy Dart stop. There are dead areas still in downtown, but this is definitely not one of them.


I haven't spent that much time in this immediate area, but this is about what I would expect to hear.

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Tivo_Kenevil
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Re: DTD: The National/Thompson Hotel (1401 Elm)

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 19 Dec 2022 15:32

EMC corridors are lively, it's the area by Farmers and Field St, Arts District that are Dead AF as the kids say. Definitely not lit.