North Dallas: Galleria

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mhainli
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby mhainli » 13 Oct 2022 16:13

Addison wrote:What bothers me about this whole thing is that the Galleria is still, on the whole, a healthy & vibrant mall. It's not as though the place is on its death bed like Music City Mall or Shops ar Willow Bend. Trademark is essentially throwing out the baby with the bath water.

Despite some of the dour posts on here, both the Macy's and Nordstrom's there are still the 2nd best performing in the Metroplex, the mall is still managing to attract/retain prominent national retailers, and it's still in an ideal/central location (the affluent Tollway corridor) to remain successful in the coming years.

The mall could definitely use a huge renovation, and the sewage/parking problems we've heard reports about should be addressed, but when I see neither Stonebriar or NorthPark having discussions about shrinking retail space nor having trouble attracting new stores, I find it hard to believe the Galleria's can't thrive in its current state going forward with just a bit of TLC.

Thank you Addison for this post. I also think that the Galleria has high potential. It’s a great location. It already has many of the things that other malls are trying to incorporate: office, hotel, etc. The current concept from Trademark adds even more of these uses to a very constrained site and seems overkill. The south end 4 tower proposal needs to be looked at in 3D before any decisions are made. Some of the Galleria’s challenges do need to be addressed however: lack of surface parking, awkward ramping parking garages, awkward ingress/egress from garages into mall, site lines within mall, lack of restaurants accessible from both surface parking side and mall side. If it takes removing some retail and the awkward Blue Garage to address the above, so be it. Even creating 80-100 surface parking spaces for restaurants and a new smaller garage for new office/hotel/restaurant uses would help. How ‘bout instead of 4 new towers, 1 or 2 mixed use towers with underground parking to reduce overall footprint? Some creativity or pop (that I didn’t see with this proposal) would be nice…

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The_Overdog
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby The_Overdog » 13 Oct 2022 16:32

You think The Galleria needs more and better surface parking so that people can go to restaurants attached to a mall? Man, I've heard everything...

To add more: Northpark has a good amount of surface parking and barely acceptable at best restaurants. If they can't really pull off fine dining any better than The Galleria with Grand Lux, why would adding more dramatically help The Galleria?

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Addison
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 13 Oct 2022 17:13

The_Overdog wrote:You think The Galleria needs more and better surface parking so that people can go to restaurants attached to a mall? Man, I've heard everything...

To add more: Northpark has a good amount of surface parking and barely acceptable at best restaurants. If they can't really pull off fine dining any better than The Galleria with Grand Lux, why would adding more dramatically help The Galleria?


The tangent about restaurants at the Galleria aside, the overarching point being made is that it can be a pain navigating those parking garages, and that doesn't help with attracting more traffic to the mall (many people in fact actively avoid the mall for this reason).

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rono3849
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby rono3849 » 13 Oct 2022 17:58

The Galleria's parking was always an issue, even when it opened. The garages are a maze. The underground parking was always awful. I never understood why Hines built such a lousy parking situation. The Macy's garage has always been a nightmare. We'll see what happens if and when this new update transpires. I do think another office tower, apartment tower, and hotel tower will give the mall more foot traffic. How couldn't it? What they do with the North end of the mall should be interesting, especially the huge empty anchor building.
Last edited by rono3849 on 14 Oct 2022 23:53, edited 1 time in total.

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The_Overdog
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby The_Overdog » 14 Oct 2022 09:14

The tangent about restaurants at the Galleria aside, the overarching point being made is that it can be a pain navigating those parking garages, and that doesn't help with attracting more traffic to the mall (many people in fact actively avoid the mall for this reason).


I don't think you can make that claim. Valley View - destroyed. Collin Creek - destroyed. Music City Mall - struggling. A few people may stay away because of the parking situation, but improving it via open parking authoritatively and qualitatively doesn't save a mall.

And 'connecting them better' could very well mean more direct and enclosed paths from the garages into the buildings.

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I45Tex
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby I45Tex » 14 Oct 2022 10:05

There was coverage at the time the mall was built about how closely Hines and his lieutenants studied and laid out the stores' geometries and pedestrian flows in and out. Link if you want it. But it seems that the parking spaces themselves must have been less closely studied and rethought.

They were a labyrinthine afterthought at the initial Houston Galleria and Galleria II addition, and each was such a megahit that maybe they weren't concerned that it could be/become an issue. But the Houston garage is a claustrophobically low-ceilinged maze of ramps to this day.

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Addison
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 14 Oct 2022 10:31

The_Overdog wrote:
The tangent about restaurants at the Galleria aside, the overarching point being made is that it can be a pain navigating those parking garages, and that doesn't help with attracting more traffic to the mall (many people in fact actively avoid the mall for this reason).


I don't think you can make that claim. Valley View - destroyed. Collin Creek - destroyed. Music City Mall - struggling. A few people may stay away because of the parking situation, but improving it via open parking authoritatively and qualitatively doesn't save a mall.

And 'connecting them better' could very well mean more direct and enclosed paths from the garages into the buildings.


I never said the solution was open parking.

The point *I* was making is that an earnest effort should first be made to address the Galleria's relatively minor deficiencies to increase traffic & attract stores before resorting to the extreme measure of destroying what is still a successful mall (the Galleria may not be "NorthPark" successful, but that shouldn't be the standard).

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mhainli
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby mhainli » 14 Oct 2022 20:08

Addison wrote:
The_Overdog wrote:
The tangent about restaurants at the Galleria aside, the overarching point being made is that it can be a pain navigating those parking garages, and that doesn't help with attracting more traffic to the mall (many people in fact actively avoid the mall for this reason).


I don't think you can make that claim. Valley View - destroyed. Collin Creek - destroyed. Music City Mall - struggling. A few people may stay away because of the parking situation, but improving it via open parking authoritatively and qualitatively doesn't save a mall.

And 'connecting them better' could very well mean more direct and enclosed paths from the garages into the buildings.


I never said the solution was open parking.

The point *I* was making is that an earnest effort should first be made to address the Galleria's relatively minor deficiencies to increase traffic & attract stores before resorting to the extreme measure of destroying what is still a successful mall (the Galleria may not be "NorthPark" successful, but that shouldn't be the standard).


Yes indeed. Seems like the focus is on redevelopment- not fixing issues with the mall or making it easy for shoppers. Here’s a quote in the DMN article from Trademark CEO Terry Montesi:

“Take down 20% of the mall, add a multifamily tower, an office tower, a boutique hotel and public space,” he said. “That’s what people want now — mixed-use.”

Interesting, it’s probably what the owners of struggling malls now want, but the Galleria has always had mixed-use (albeit not well connected). So the question is - what is the right balance for this mall, at this location, with this already constrained site? At what point is the mall and mall interests so crowded out and secondary that it becomes doomed? Would a lesser/smarter redevelopment plan with a laser focus on shopper experience improvements be better in the long run (what’s good for the mall is good for everything else)?? The current concept is not very detailed but basically eliminates a southern parking option for shoppers now that the smaller Blue Garage will be for offices. Same applies to the new restaurants sprinkled throughout the new buildings - very little self parking opportunities. And nothing eye popping, like a grand south end mall entrance, at one of the busiest highway intersections in the Metroplex??

To be clear, I support removing retail space - especially the awkward Gap and Belk spaces, but I’m hoping that these Trademark plans will change once details become more available and retailers give feedback. If not we’ll be having this same discussion in 10 years before the next round of demo….

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rono3849
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby rono3849 » 14 Oct 2022 23:57

I went by the Galleria today and the parking garage on the South side was full. I've got to believe the new office tower, residential tower, and hotel will have underground parking. They have to. There's no other place for the cars associated with those buildings to go.

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mhainli
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby mhainli » 15 Oct 2022 11:24

rono3849 wrote:I went by the Galleria today and the parking garage on the South side was full. I've got to believe the new office tower, residential tower, and hotel will have underground parking. They have to. There's no other place for the cars associated with those buildings to go.

According to the DMN graphic, the two proposed office towers are directly connected to the proposed now smaller Blue Garage. It makes sense. Not realistic to expect a shopper to park in the Blue Garage, go down to ground level and trek around the apartments and “great lawn” to enter the new mall entrance. Perhaps the existing underground Purple Garage will be expanded to serve the hotel and apartment towers? So back to the original question - where is the retail parking at the south end? Makes me think this is another conceptual plan with details not yet thought out.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby acclar11 » 19 Oct 2022 19:50


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Addison
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 22 Nov 2022 18:19

Galleria Dallas to make it snow every day starting Black Friday

https://www-dallasnews-com.cdn.ampproje ... utType=amp

It’s going to start snowing at Galleria Dallas on the day after Thanksgiving, and it won’t stop until Christmas Eve.

The North Dallas mall is living up to its reputation for putting shoppers in the holiday mood with décor that includes a 95-foot tree in the ice rink, an 11,000-square-foot Snow Day experience, a train ride leading to a visit with Santa and now snow.

The shopping center has hired the same company that makes snow at Disneyland in Los Angeles and creates outdoor scenes for news crews from Fox Sports and the Today show.

The snow will fall in the main entrance — the one with palm trees facing the North Dallas Tollway — Nov. 25 through Dec. 24 on Mondays through Thursdays at 5 p.m. and 7 p.m., Fridays and Saturdays at 2 p.m., 5 p.m. and 7 p.m., and Sundays at 2 p.m. and 5 p.m.

Each snowfall will last 6 minutes and there are 25 flocked trees for photo backdrops.

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Addison
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 28 Nov 2022 08:52

There's a construction RFP for an Italian lingerie boutique called Intimissimi. It seems this will be the first location in DFW (and maybe Texas?).

So far, they only have locations in NYC, LA Boston, Philadelphia, DC, Las Vegas, Tampa and Orlando...

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby acclar11 » 21 Dec 2022 15:02

New owner, but looks like Trademark is here to stay as manager.
https://www.dallasnews.com/business/rea ... eria-mall/

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Tucy
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Tucy » 21 Dec 2022 16:15

Hmmm... Ownership of the Galleria is taken over by its lenders... "Struggling" indeed.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby acclar11 » 21 Dec 2022 17:16

Tucy wrote:Hmmm... Ownership of the Galleria is taken over by its lenders... "Struggling" indeed.

It's no secret the mall is struggling. Pottery Barn, The Grill On The Alley, and Belk all closed. Nordstrom is down to two floors, an entire portion of the mall is vacant, major chain stores aren't able to last, luxury tenants are few and far between, and the first floor is covered in wallboard. The center definitely peaked in 2003/2004, before Northpark expanded, right after Willow Bend began its quick demise, and before HP Village went ultra luxury. With Legacy West open and Northpark just getting nicer, designer stores are finding better places to flock to. I hope the new owners have a good redevelopment plan in place, or Trademark gets started on the one that has been planned for almost three years.

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Tucy
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Tucy » 21 Dec 2022 17:24

acclar11 wrote:
Tucy wrote:Hmmm... Ownership of the Galleria is taken over by its lenders... "Struggling" indeed.

It's no secret the mall is struggling. Pottery Barn, The Grill On The Alley, and Belk all closed. Nordstrom is down to two floors, an entire portion of the mall is vacant, major chain stores aren't able to last, luxury tenants are few and far between, and the first floor is covered in wallboard. The center definitely peaked in 2003/2004, before Northpark expanded, right after Willow Bend began its quick demise, and before HP Village went ultra luxury. With Legacy West open and Northpark just getting nicer, designer stores are finding better places to flock to. I hope the new owners have a good redevelopment plan in place, or Trademark gets started on the one that has been planned for almost three years.


Shhhhh... don't tell Addison. ;-)

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Addison
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 21 Dec 2022 18:36

Tucy wrote:
acclar11 wrote:
Tucy wrote:Hmmm... Ownership of the Galleria is taken over by its lenders... "Struggling" indeed.

It's no secret the mall is struggling. Pottery Barn, The Grill On The Alley, and Belk all closed. Nordstrom is down to two floors, an entire portion of the mall is vacant, major chain stores aren't able to last, luxury tenants are few and far between, and the first floor is covered in wallboard. The center definitely peaked in 2003/2004, before Northpark expanded, right after Willow Bend began its quick demise, and before HP Village went ultra luxury. With Legacy West open and Northpark just getting nicer, designer stores are finding better places to flock to. I hope the new owners have a good redevelopment plan in place, or Trademark gets started on the one that has been planned for almost three years.


Shhhhh... don't tell Addison. ;-)


Not sure what that is supppsed to mean, but it's probably not a good idea to read too much into this without knowing the finer details behind the ownership transfer.

The Nordstrom (which, BTW, most of their stores are only 2 stories) and Macy's are both still the 2nd highest grossing in the Metroplex, Louis Vuitton is actually expanding their store, the mall still gets great foot traffic and there have been a number of new (national) retailers opening in the mall.

Furthermore, we don't know the circumstance behind Belk and Pottery Barn leaving (other than it happened after Trademark took over *AND* they just so happened to be located where Trademark wants to tear down retail space). As far as Grill on the Alley closing, as was the case with many restaurants across the country, that can probably be blamed on COVID more than anything.

Is it a mall that has seen better days? For sure. But it's far from struggling. In fact, it's still the (by far) healthiest mall in the Metroplex besides NorthPark and (maybe) Stonebriar.

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Tucy
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Tucy » 22 Dec 2022 10:06

Addison wrote:
Tucy wrote:
acclar11 wrote:It's no secret the mall is struggling. Pottery Barn, The Grill On The Alley, and Belk all closed. Nordstrom is down to two floors, an entire portion of the mall is vacant, major chain stores aren't able to last, luxury tenants are few and far between, and the first floor is covered in wallboard. The center definitely peaked in 2003/2004, before Northpark expanded, right after Willow Bend began its quick demise, and before HP Village went ultra luxury. With Legacy West open and Northpark just getting nicer, designer stores are finding better places to flock to. I hope the new owners have a good redevelopment plan in place, or Trademark gets started on the one that has been planned for almost three years.


Shhhhh... don't tell Addison. ;-)


Not sure what that is supppsed to mean, but it's probably not a good idea to read too much into this without knowing the finer details behind the ownership transfer.

The Nordstrom (which, BTW, most of their stores are only 2 stories) and Macy's are both still the 2nd highest grossing in the Metroplex, Louis Vuitton is actually expanding their store, the mall still gets great foot traffic and there have been a number of new (national) retailers opening in the mall.

Furthermore, we don't know the circumstance behind Belk and Pottery Barn leaving (other than it happened after Trademark took over *AND* they just so happened to be located where Trademark wants to tear down retail space). As far as Grill on the Alley closing, as was the case with many restaurants across the country, that can probably be blamed on COVID more than anything.

Is it a mall that has seen better days? For sure. But it's far from struggling. In fact, it's still the (by far) healthiest mall in the Metroplex besides NorthPark and (maybe) Stonebriar.


One doesn't need to see finer details - it is NEVER a good day when the lender takes ownership of your property. Never. Not for anyone - either lender or borrower. While we may not know the detailed circumstances (whatever that might mean) of Belk and Pottery Barn, what we can say with complete confidence is that retailers do not close stores that are performing well and shopping centers do not encourage the closure of stores that are performing well. Especially anchor stores and other significant national tenants (e.g, Pottery Barn).

Re: LV, do we actually know that they are expanding? Last I saw it was merely speculation as to whether they were expanding or relocating (and down-sizing), or for that matter, whether they were doing anything at all. Has anyone found a building permit? I can't find any...
Last edited by Tucy on 24 Mar 2023 10:57, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby acclar11 » 22 Dec 2022 10:23

Tucy wrote:
Addison wrote:
Tucy wrote:
Shhhhh... don't tell Addison. ;-)


Not sure what that is supppsed to mean, but it's probably not a good idea to read too much into this without knowing the finer details behind the ownership transfer.

The Nordstrom (which, BTW, most of their stores are only 2 stories) and Macy's are both still the 2nd highest grossing in the Metroplex, Louis Vuitton is actually expanding their store, the mall still gets great foot traffic and there have been a number of new (national) retailers opening in the mall.

Furthermore, we don't know the circumstance behind Belk and Pottery Barn leaving (other than it happened after Trademark took over *AND* they just so happened to be located where Trademark wants to tear down retail space). As far as Grill on the Alley closing, as was the case with many restaurants across the country, that can probably be blamed on COVID more than anything.

Is it a mall that has seen better days? For sure. But it's far from struggling. In fact, it's still the (by far) healthiest mall in the Metroplex besides NorthPark and (maybe) Stonebriar.


One doesn't need to see finer details - it is NEVER a good day when the lender takes ownership of your property. Never. Not for anyone - either lender or borrower. While we may not know the detailed circumstances (whatever that might mean) of Belk and Pottery Barn, what we can say with complete confidence is that retailers do no close stores that are performing well and shopping centers do not encourage the closure of stores that are performing well. Especially anchor stores and other significant national tenants (e.g, Pottery Barn).

Re: LV, do we actually know that they are expanding? Last I saw it was merely speculation as to whether they were expanding or relocating (and down-sizing), or for that matter, whether they were doing anything at all. Has anyone found a building permit? I can't find any...

I went there in September and the SA told me that they were planning on expanding. But I agree, it’s odd we haven’t seen any permits filed yet.

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Addison
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 22 Dec 2022 10:45

Tucy wrote:
Addison wrote:
Tucy wrote:
Shhhhh... don't tell Addison. ;-)


Not sure what that is supppsed to mean, but it's probably not a good idea to read too much into this without knowing the finer details behind the ownership transfer.

The Nordstrom (which, BTW, most of their stores are only 2 stories) and Macy's are both still the 2nd highest grossing in the Metroplex, Louis Vuitton is actually expanding their store, the mall still gets great foot traffic and there have been a number of new (national) retailers opening in the mall.

Furthermore, we don't know the circumstance behind Belk and Pottery Barn leaving (other than it happened after Trademark took over *AND* they just so happened to be located where Trademark wants to tear down retail space). As far as Grill on the Alley closing, as was the case with many restaurants across the country, that can probably be blamed on COVID more than anything.

Is it a mall that has seen better days? For sure. But it's far from struggling. In fact, it's still the (by far) healthiest mall in the Metroplex besides NorthPark and (maybe) Stonebriar.


One doesn't need to see finer details - it is NEVER a good day when the lender takes ownership of your property. Never. Not for anyone - either lender or borrower. While we may not know the detailed circumstances (whatever that might mean) of Belk and Pottery Barn, what we can say with complete confidence is that retailers do no close stores that are performing well and shopping centers do not encourage the closure of stores that are performing well. Especially anchor stores and other significant national tenants (e.g, Pottery Barn).

Re: LV, do we actually know that they are expanding? Last I saw it was merely speculation as to whether they were expanding or relocating (and down-sizing), or for that matter, whether they were doing anything at all. Has anyone found a building permit? I can't find any...


There's a whole lot of baseless assumptions in your post.

acclar1 already responded regarding LV, so I'll move on beyond that.

As far as the lender taking over the deed, landlords can voluntarily hand over their mortgages / deeds to lenders when they're no longer interested in owning property. Nothing in the article suggests the Galleria is unprofitable, nor that UBS defaulted on any of their loans (both of which would be *REAL* signs of a struggling mall). Maybe UBS just wants to get out of the shopping mall business altogether and shift their focus to other ventures. Who really knows.

As far as Belk and Pottery Barn, again, stores can close for any number of reasons that have nothing to do with their performance, and the stores might have no choice in the decision. Perhaps Trademark offered them unreasonable leasing terms, or perhaps Trademark chose to not renew their lease thinking their pet project to destroy huge sections of the Galleria will be a much more lucrative direction forward. Or perhaps Belk wanted to have the plumbing issues that have been discussed before to be addressed and Trademark refused.

In essence, all you're doing here is speculating with no hard evidence to back up any of what you say.

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Tucy
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Tucy » 22 Dec 2022 11:13

Addison wrote:
Tucy wrote:
Addison wrote:
Not sure what that is supppsed to mean, but it's probably not a good idea to read too much into this without knowing the finer details behind the ownership transfer.

The Nordstrom (which, BTW, most of their stores are only 2 stories) and Macy's are both still the 2nd highest grossing in the Metroplex, Louis Vuitton is actually expanding their store, the mall still gets great foot traffic and there have been a number of new (national) retailers opening in the mall.

Furthermore, we don't know the circumstance behind Belk and Pottery Barn leaving (other than it happened after Trademark took over *AND* they just so happened to be located where Trademark wants to tear down retail space). As far as Grill on the Alley closing, as was the case with many restaurants across the country, that can probably be blamed on COVID more than anything.

Is it a mall that has seen better days? For sure. But it's far from struggling. In fact, it's still the (by far) healthiest mall in the Metroplex besides NorthPark and (maybe) Stonebriar.


One doesn't need to see finer details - it is NEVER a good day when the lender takes ownership of your property. Never. Not for anyone - either lender or borrower. While we may not know the detailed circumstances (whatever that might mean) of Belk and Pottery Barn, what we can say with complete confidence is that retailers do no close stores that are performing well and shopping centers do not encourage the closure of stores that are performing well. Especially anchor stores and other significant national tenants (e.g, Pottery Barn).

Re: LV, do we actually know that they are expanding? Last I saw it was merely speculation as to whether they were expanding or relocating (and down-sizing), or for that matter, whether they were doing anything at all. Has anyone found a building permit? I can't find any...


There's a whole lot of baseless assumptions in your post.

acclar1 already responded regarding LV, so I'll move on beyond that.

As far as the lender taking over the deed, landlords can voluntarily hand over their mortgages / deeds to lenders when they're no longer interested in owning property. Nothing in the article suggests the Galleria is unprofitable, nor that UBS defaulted on any of their loans (both of which would be *REAL* signs of a struggling mall). Maybe UBS just wants to get out of the shopping mall business altogether and shift their focus to other ventures. Who really knows.

As far as Belk and Pottery Barn, again, stores can close for any number of reasons that have nothing to do with their performance, and the stores might have no choice in the decision. Perhaps Trademark offered them unreasonable leasing terms, or perhaps Trademark chose to not renew their lease thinking their pet project to destroy huge sections of the Galleria will be a much more lucrative direction forward. Or perhaps Belk wanted to have the plumbing issues that have been discussed before to be addressed and Trademark refused.

In essence, all you're doing here is speculating with no hard evidence to back up any of what you say.


So, I take it you don't actually know anything about whether LV is actually expanding, down-sizing, doing anything at all?

You are sounding like Baghdad Bob. The hard evidence is piling up all around you, but you apparently don't want to see it.
Last edited by Tucy on 22 Dec 2022 11:30, edited 1 time in total.

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Addison
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 22 Dec 2022 11:19

Tucy wrote:
Addison wrote:
Tucy wrote:
One doesn't need to see finer details - it is NEVER a good day when the lender takes ownership of your property. Never. Not for anyone - either lender or borrower. While we may not know the detailed circumstances (whatever that might mean) of Belk and Pottery Barn, what we can say with complete confidence is that retailers do no close stores that are performing well and shopping centers do not encourage the closure of stores that are performing well. Especially anchor stores and other significant national tenants (e.g, Pottery Barn).

Re: LV, do we actually know that they are expanding? Last I saw it was merely speculation as to whether they were expanding or relocating (and down-sizing), or for that matter, whether they were doing anything at all. Has anyone found a building permit? I can't find any...


There's a whole lot of baseless assumptions in your post.

acclar1 already responded regarding LV, so I'll move on beyond that.

As far as the lender taking over the deed, landlords can voluntarily hand over their mortgages / deeds to lenders when they're no longer interested in owning property. Nothing in the article suggests the Galleria is unprofitable, nor that UBS defaulted on any of their loans (both of which would be *REAL* signs of a struggling mall). Maybe UBS just wants to get out of the shopping mall business altogether and shift their focus to other ventures. Who really knows.

As far as Belk and Pottery Barn, again, stores can close for any number of reasons that have nothing to do with their performance, and the stores might have no choice in the decision. Perhaps Trademark offered them unreasonable leasing terms, or perhaps Trademark chose to not renew their lease thinking their pet project to destroy huge sections of the Galleria will be a much more lucrative direction forward. Or perhaps Belk wanted to have the plumbing issues that have been discussed before to be addressed and Trademark refused.

In essence, all you're doing here is speculating with no hard evidence to back up any of what you say.


You are sounding like Baghdad Bob. The hard evidence is piling up all around you, but you apparently don't want to see it.


Who is Baghdad Bob?

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Tucy
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Tucy » 22 Dec 2022 11:24

The spokesman for the Iraqi government who repeatedly went on TV declaring that Iraq was defeating the American military...

Even if UBS decided to get out of owning shopping centers (unlikely, but let's assume for the moment that it's true), they wouldn't just turn all their shopping centers over to the lenders. They would sell the good ones and turn over the bad, struggling ones, to the lenders. There is no imaginable scenario in which turning it over to the lenders is anything other than an indication the center is not doing well.
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby mhainli » 22 Dec 2022 11:33

Allow me to take some middle ground. I think the lender (Met Life) taking over ownership is not a good sign of the overall health of the mall and explains the foot dragging by UBS/Trademark on redevelopment proposals. However, it could be good sign for the future IF the mall is sold at a discount allowing a new ownership group the financial wiggle room to make the right changes and take some risk. Unfortunately, according to the DMN article it appears that Met Life will continue with Trademark and their current plan. As stated in previous posts, the recently released concept plan at the south end seems much more about tearing down existing to redevelopment and future sell off of new mixed use buildings than doing what it takes to improve the mall. Keeping a portion of the crazy Blue Garage, keeping awkward road network, shoehorning 4 buildings in there? Hopefully there is a middle ground plan that focuses on shopper experience and accessibility with a lesser emphasis on mixed use. Galleria already has more mixed use by far than any other mall in this area. An additional well positioned mixed use tower or two might be good, but done wrong it just will continue to strangle and crowd out the mall even more and someday we’ll be discussing another tear down proposal..
Last edited by mhainli on 24 Dec 2022 12:16, edited 1 time in total.

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Tucy
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Tucy » 22 Dec 2022 11:59

mhainli wrote:Allow me to take some middle ground. I think the lender (Met Life) taking over ownership is not a good sign of the overall health of the mall and explains the foot dragging by UBS/Trademark on redevelopment proposals. However, it could be good sign for the future IF the mall is sold at a discount allowing a new ownership group the financial wiggle room to make the right changes and take some risk. Unfortunately, according to the DMN article, it appears that Met Life will continue with Trademark and their current plan. As stated in previous posts, the recently released concept plan at the south end seems much more about tearing down existing to redevelopment and future sell off of new mixed use buildings than doing what it takes to improve the mall. Keeping a portion of the crazy Blue Garage, keeping awkward road network, shoehorning 4 buildings in there? Hopefully there is a middle ground plan that focuses on shopper experience and accessibility with a lesser emphasis on more mixed use. Galleria already has more mixed use, by far, than any other mall in this area. If done right there probably is some room for mixed use, but done wrong it just will continue to strangle and crowd out the mall even more.


Quite right. While the lender taking ownership is definitely not a good sign, it could lead to a better future for the center.

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Addison
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 28 Dec 2022 10:48

Galleria Dallas affirms it is not closing following viral social media rumor

https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/local ... b29bdb5958

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 28 Dec 2022 10:50

Addison wrote:Galleria Dallas affirms it is not closing following viral social media rumor

https://www.wfaa.com/article/news/local ... b29bdb5958


https://www.facebook.com/82883577226/po ... tid=Nif5oz

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Addison
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 28 Dec 2022 11:06

What's interesting to me about the Galleria's response is it suggests Trademark's proposal is not etched in stone (by saying it's only being considered as a "potential long-term redevelopment project"), which is somewhat reassuring

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby mhainli » 28 Dec 2022 14:23

Addison wrote:What's interesting to me about the Galleria's response is it suggests Trademark's proposal is not etched in stone (by saying it's only being considered as a "potential long-term redevelopment project"), which is somewhat reassuring

Yes, let’s hope for something better than the latest Trademark concept proposal for the mall’s south end. Something more mall focused please..

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby acclar11 » 26 Jan 2023 07:56

https://www.tdlr.texas.gov/TABS/Search/ ... 2023010225
I assume the LV expansion is happening soon- they're opening a temp. store in the former Bebe spot.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Cbdallas » 26 Jan 2023 08:40

I think the issue with this is that the surrounding areas to get to this mall are either empty lots or run down strip centers. The whole area needs cohesive redevelopment not just the Galleria itself. It feels a bit like an island because of the general area.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 26 Jan 2023 09:31

Cbdallas wrote:I think the issue with this is that the surrounding areas to get to this mall are either empty lots or run down strip centers. The whole area needs cohesive redevelopment not just the Galleria itself. It feels a bit like an island because of the general area.


The area is sketchy for sure.

There's plenty of wealth and corporate offices within a few mile radius, along with a huge variety of big box stores (albeit it's all disjointed) that many other parts of DFW would love to have.

But the area immediately abutting the Galleria to the NE
is worn down for sure with all the low-income housing, check cashing places, and the hulking crumbling remnants of a dead mall. It's certainly different from when you're driving up to Stonebriar or NorthPark, where you see a bunch of fancy-looking street fixtures, well-manicured scrubbery and a bunch of more modern-looking strip malls / office towers.

And Midtown (or whatever it's called now) would be the project to address this, if it ever happens (probably won't).

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby vman » 26 Jan 2023 11:23

Addison wrote:
Cbdallas wrote:I think the issue with this is that the surrounding areas to get to this mall are either empty lots or run down strip centers. The whole area needs cohesive redevelopment not just the Galleria itself. It feels a bit like an island because of the general area.


The area is sketchy for sure.

There's plenty of wealth and corporate offices within a few mile radius, along with a huge variety of big box stores (albeit it's all disjointed) that many other parts of DFW would love to have.

But the area immediately abutting the Galleria to the NE
is worn down for sure with all the low-income housing, check cashing places, and the hulking crumbling remnants of a dead mall. It's certainly different from when you're driving up to Stonebriar or NorthPark, where you see a bunch of fancy-looking street fixtures, well-manicured scrubbery and a bunch of more modern-looking strip malls / office towers.

And Midtown (or whatever it's called now) would be the project to address this, if it ever happens (probably won't).

I'm old enough to remember that as a kid, the area around the Houston Galleria wasn't all that great either and we see how that has changed. It can be done.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 26 Jan 2023 11:27

vman wrote:
Addison wrote:
Cbdallas wrote:I think the issue with this is that the surrounding areas to get to this mall are either empty lots or run down strip centers. The whole area needs cohesive redevelopment not just the Galleria itself. It feels a bit like an island because of the general area.


The area is sketchy for sure.

There's plenty of wealth and corporate offices within a few mile radius, along with a huge variety of big box stores (albeit it's all disjointed) that many other parts of DFW would love to have.

But the area immediately abutting the Galleria to the NE
is worn down for sure with all the low-income housing, check cashing places, and the hulking crumbling remnants of a dead mall. It's certainly different from when you're driving up to Stonebriar or NorthPark, where you see a bunch of fancy-looking street fixtures, well-manicured scrubbery and a bunch of more modern-looking strip malls / office towers.

And Midtown (or whatever it's called now) would be the project to address this, if it ever happens (probably won't).

I'm old enough to remember that as a kid, the area around the Houston Galleria wasn't all that great either and we see how that has changed. It can be done.


But of course, Houston's Galleria doesn't have a NorthPark to compete with either...

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby I45Tex » 26 Jan 2023 12:35

Plus Hines built Dallas' Galleria later and farther out from downtown. Houston Galleria is the same distance from downtown as Preston Center -- Loop 610 is close to the size of Loop 12.
Dallas Galleria is really equivalent to Memorial City Mall's location.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby I45Tex » 26 Jan 2023 12:40

I think this area would be healthier if the land was not in such large chunks.

It is such a different path to interest strip mall and apartment complex owners in multi acre demolition and redevelopment -- & even if you can, the new stuff will get old and decrepit all at once, over again in the future, just like it did now -- than to build gradual reinvestment momentum in a neighborhood of many urban buildings under hundreds of different owners. There's not as much of a natural toe-hold.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby rono3849 » 26 Jan 2023 17:20

The area around the Galleria is fine except for the vast wasteland that was Valley View Mall and the section 8 apartments North of Alpha Road. The residents of the apartments used Valley View as their playground and then the crime hit the parking lots, hence the collapse of Valley View's viability of being a safe place to shop. Some of those same residents have attempted to do the same with the Galleria, but have been met with more security resistance. The low end retail shops along Montfort and Alpha are a blight on the area. I suspect that will eventually be leveled if and when the development to replace Valley View moves forward.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 29 Jan 2023 22:47

I was at both the Galleria and Stonebriar today, specifically on the 2nd/3rd floors (Galleria) and Nordstrom (both).

I gotta say, the former felt much deader than the latter (relatively speaking).

Several things I noticed:

1. Nestle Toll House Cafe at the Galleria has closed and Great American Cookies will be moving into its spot. Haagen-Dasz, however, will be returning alongside Great American Cookies once the space is renovated.

2. The White Barn space at Stonebriar has been shuttered & boarded up, whereas the White Barn storefront at the Galleria is still open.

3. You can still access Nordstrom's 3rd floor at The Galleria from inside the department store, as the Marketplace Cafe is still open. However, the former retail space has been completely walled off.

4. A significant part of the 2nd floor was blocked off, though I'm not sure why (the signage didn't say, other than improvements are being made).

5. Stonebriar's Nordstrom store definitely seemed to be better staffed, have a better utilization of its floor space, and more inventory in general.

I didn't go on the Galleria's 1st floor today, but I did notice on the directory map (via their website) there seems to be quite a bit of vacant space down there as a late.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Proquest20 » 31 Jan 2023 17:12

Addison wrote:I was at both the Galleria and Stonebriar today, specifically on the 2nd/3rd floors (Galleria) and Nordstrom (both).

I gotta say, the former felt much deader than the latter (relatively speaking).

Several things I noticed:

1. Nestle Toll House Cafe at the Galleria has closed and Great American Cookies will be moving into its spot. Haagen-Dasz, however, will be returning alongside Great American Cookies once the space is renovated.

2. The White Barn space at Stonebriar has been shuttered & boarded up, whereas the White Barn storefront at the Galleria is still open.

3. You can still access Nordstrom's 3rd floor at The Galleria from inside the department store, as the Marketplace Cafe is still open. However, the former retail space has been completely walled off.

4. A significant part of the 2nd floor was blocked off, though I'm not sure why (the signage didn't say, other than improvements are being made).

5. Stonebriar's Nordstrom store definitely seemed to be better staffed, have a better utilization of its floor space, and more inventory in general.

I didn't go on the Galleria's 1st floor today, but I did notice on the directory map (via their website) there seems to be quite a bit of vacant space down there as a late.


From my understanding the Galleria’s Nordstrom is getting a new food concept on the second floor. Then they’ll close the Marketplace Cafe. They may also be making other improvements, but that’s the one I’m most certain about. Did you go to the first floor of this Nordstrom?

There were also two Nestle Tollhouse Cafes at the Galleria, with the other one being in front of Lululemon. Is that one still there?

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 31 Jan 2023 18:16

Proquest20 wrote:
Addison wrote:I was at both the Galleria and Stonebriar today, specifically on the 2nd/3rd floors (Galleria) and Nordstrom (both).

I gotta say, the former felt much deader than the latter (relatively speaking).

Several things I noticed:

1. Nestle Toll House Cafe at the Galleria has closed and Great American Cookies will be moving into its spot. Haagen-Dasz, however, will be returning alongside Great American Cookies once the space is renovated.

2. The White Barn space at Stonebriar has been shuttered & boarded up, whereas the White Barn storefront at the Galleria is still open.

3. You can still access Nordstrom's 3rd floor at The Galleria from inside the department store, as the Marketplace Cafe is still open. However, the former retail space has been completely walled off.

4. A significant part of the 2nd floor was blocked off, though I'm not sure why (the signage didn't say, other than improvements are being made).

5. Stonebriar's Nordstrom store definitely seemed to be better staffed, have a better utilization of its floor space, and more inventory in general.

I didn't go on the Galleria's 1st floor today, but I did notice on the directory map (via their website) there seems to be quite a bit of vacant space down there as a late.


From my understanding the Galleria’s Nordstrom is getting a new food concept on the second floor. Then they’ll close the Marketplace Cafe. They may also be making other improvements, but that’s the one I’m most certain about. Did you go to the first floor of this Nordstrom?

There were also two Nestle Tollhouse Cafes at the Galleria, with the other one being in front of Lululemon. Is that one still there?


I did go down to the first floor of Nordstrom, yes, but just to use the restroom. Other than passively looking at some coats (and they had a pitiful selection), I was passing through to go to H&M and Journeys.

I don't know anything about there being 2 Nestle Toll House Cafes in the Galleria, although I know Great American Cookies is currently located in another part of the mall by the skating rink.

It seems the Nestle Toll House Cafes are all gradually closing though. Locations at Town East, Stonebriar, CityPlace and The Star have been shuttered as well. Only Firewheel, Highland Village and Sundance Square remain for now. I'm actually sad to see them go, as their cookies are much better than the crap Great American Cookies sells. I would actually make special trips to the Galleria just to get the Oatmeal Cookies.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby acclar11 » 01 Feb 2023 20:20

https://f.hubspotusercontent40.net/hubf ... Levels.pdf
Newly updated lease plan for Galleria Dallas. It now reflects the Bachendorf's expansion and a few other tenant changes, but that's about it. No new news for the former Belk space, vacant spots on the first level, or Nordstrom third floor.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby R1070 » 08 Feb 2023 20:39

Mango is opening at the Galleria (I think in the old Pottery Barn space): https://galleriadallas.com/directory/retail/mango
That's a pretty big deal! I hope they continue to get new to market retailers there.
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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 08 Feb 2023 20:43

R1070 wrote:Mango is opening at the Galleria. That's a pretty big deal! I hope they continue to get new to market retailers there.
https://galleriadallas.com/directory/retail/mango


Intimissimi was a pretty big score too.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Proquest20 » 08 Feb 2023 22:17

R1070 wrote:Mango is opening at the Galleria (I think in the old Pottery Barn space): https://galleriadallas.com/directory/retail/mango
That's a pretty big deal! I hope they continue to get new to market retailers there.


HUGE score! Definitely a big appeal with the international shoppers. The brand has been sold at Macy's, but I do see the Galleria as a better fit for this one than NorthPark due to it not exactly being a high end brand. I'll definitely be shopping there pretty frequently, and adding it to my Galleria checklist.

Now, if only that closed Vineyard Vines from Willow Bend/Grapevine Mills would move down to the Galleria...

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby acclar11 » 11 Feb 2023 17:55

R1070 wrote:Mango is opening at the Galleria (I think in the old Pottery Barn space): https://galleriadallas.com/directory/retail/mango
That's a pretty big deal! I hope they continue to get new to market retailers there.

I think they'll open in the former Tesla, or even combine the J. Crew/Talbots/Tesla spots for a junior anchor sized store.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby rono3849 » 11 Feb 2023 20:34

I hadn't been in the Galleria in some time and was there on Thursday. It's got so many empty storefronts that it's really sad. The area between the ice rink and Gap/Old Navy/Banana Republic building is virtually empty. This would be the wing they plan on demolishing. Perhaps they are letting leases run out and then the wrecking ball will commence leveling this part of the mall.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Proquest20 » 11 Feb 2023 22:53

rono3849 wrote:I hadn't been in the Galleria in some time and was there on Thursday. It's got so many empty storefronts that it's really sad. The area between the ice rink and Gap/Old Navy/Banana Republic building is virtually empty. This would be the wing they plan on demolishing. Perhaps they are letting leases run out and then the wrecking ball will commence leveling this part of the mall.

Yeah, the first floor especially is not what it once was anymore. Personally I believe some stores NorthPark has could survive with a second location at the Galleria (ones like Nespresso, Allsaints, Alo, Aritzia, Vineyard Vines, etc;)

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Addison » 12 Feb 2023 09:44

The fact that they easily scored Mango and Intimissimi back-to-back (not to mention Garage and Stance a little while back) suggests to me Trademark could fill that space if they put more effort into their leasing strategy.

It should be noted, the 2nd and 3rd floors are pretty well occupied aside from the Belk / Saks space.

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Re: North Dallas: Galleria

Postby Proquest20 » 12 Feb 2023 11:34

Addison wrote:The fact that they easily scored Mango and Intimissimi back-to-back (not to mention Garage and Stance a little while back) suggests to me Trademark could fill that space if they put more effort into their leasing strategy.

It should be noted, the 2nd and 3rd floors are pretty well occupied aside from the Belk / Saks space.


Exactly. I wouldn’t call the Galleria dead, but it’s certainly not high end anymore. Still, it gets most mid-range stores before Stonebriar, Parks, or NorthEast do.