Dallas Fort Worth Urban Forum

Posted: **30 Apr 2021 10:22**

THRILLHO wrote:I agree. I think East Quarter, Design District, and Cedars will be the areas to watch grow this decade (in that order). Meanwhile Deep Ellum and maybe Trinity Groves will be adding decent height.

I am curious as to why people put EQ and DD at the top of the list for future development. Each of those areas is controlled by a single developer. What happens there will be more of a function of what they want to do, and less of what an open market is asking for. Open areas like DE seem to offer more opportunities.

Posted: **30 Apr 2021 12:36**

undefinedprocess wrote:Victory Commons Two & Three would be such a waste.

Why do you say that?

Posted: **30 Apr 2021 12:52**

willyk wrote:I am curious as to why people put EQ and DD at the top of the list for future development. Each of those areas is controlled by a single developer. What happens there will be more of a function of what they want to do, and less of what an open market is asking for. Open areas like DE seem to offer more opportunities.

That's a good point. It does seem promising that the East Quarter was pretty quickly to throw up a high-rise, so I'd imagine they'd be quick to develop another one if the demand was there.

The Design District has been very slow to develop, IMO. I'm glad we got the Virgin hotel and are now getting another high-rise right next to it, but I'm really hoping things pick up for this area sometime in the next decade.

Posted: **01 May 2021 17:45**

willyk wrote:I am curious as to why people put EQ and DD at the top of the list for future development. Each of those areas is controlled by a single developer. What happens there will be more of a function of what they want to do, and less of what an open market is asking for. Open areas like DE seem to offer more opportunities.

I would say East Quarter is at top because it is underdeveloped land next to Deep Ellum, which currently could fight for title as most popular neighborhood in town. I would say the Design District because it is underdeveloped with large roads between Uptown and West Dallas. Uptown is uptown and West Dallas has been very low key booming in the single family home department as well as multifamily properties.

Posted: **04 May 2021 11:31**

DPatel304 wrote:
undefinedprocess wrote:Victory Commons Two & Three would be such a waste.

Why do you say that?

Generic, zero effort office towers with more parking garages lining 35. Would much rather see some more residential, or even mixed-use towers go in there, all the way up to The Katy. I'm not completely opposed to them because it's better than nothing, but damn. They could really do something special with those lots, even if it's not residential. They're just copied and pasted version of VC1, and could be so much more. But any surface lots being developed, especially in Victory Park, is a win, so...

Guess beggars can't be choosers when it comes to Dallas.

Posted: **04 May 2021 12:00**

undefinedprocess wrote:
DPatel304 wrote:
undefinedprocess wrote:Victory Commons Two & Three would be such a waste.

Why do you say that?

Generic, zero effort office towers with more parking garages lining 35. Would much rather see some more residential, or even mixed-use towers go in there, all the way up to The Katy. I'm not completely opposed to them because it's better than nothing, but damn. They could really do something special with those lots, even if it's not residential. They're just copied and pasted version of VC1, and could be so much more. But any surface lots being developed, especially in Victory Park, is a win, so...

Guess beggars can't be choosers when it comes to Dallas.

Ah gotcha, I agree with you there. I didn't really know much about Victory Commons, so I don't really have any issues with it.

I do agree with you though, that space could certainly be put to better use, especially considering it's walking distance to the DART station there and the Katy trailhead isn't too far either.

Posted: **04 May 2021 12:16**

Perot isn't very successful in building "statement" towers as we know. The Field Street site is floundering as other developments continue to move ahead. Maybe the organization just doesn't have the vision others seem to have. The Field Street spot is such a prime location that it's hard to believe they can't get a tenant for the tower they proposed, plus a hotel & condo going in conjunction with the office portion of the development. Maybe he should sell the site to some company with more drive.

Posted: **04 May 2021 14:25**

I suggested a while back he should sell it to Amli, assuming the first tower is successful. Does seem a shame that a Marquee name on top of an 80 story tower isn't built there. Not enough demand for that much space apparently. So instead, we get law firms taking 150k space in nondescript 22 story towers.

Posted: **04 May 2021 17:48**

Perot's Urban Hillwood took their signs off of the fence surrounding their Field Street site. I drove by the location today and all signs are gone. I have no idea what that might mean. We'll see.

Posted: **06 May 2021 10:20**

rono3849 wrote:Perot's Urban Hillwood took their signs off of the fence surrounding their Field Street site. I drove by the location today and all signs are gone. I have no idea what that might mean. We'll see.

Maybe they gave up on a big office development. This should have always been big mixed use not just big office.

Posted: **06 May 2021 14:56**

Exactly. One use just doesn’t make sense for this site

Posted: **03 Jun 2021 09:20**

undefinedprocess wrote:Victory Commons Two & Three would be such a waste.

why?

Posted: **03 Jun 2021 09:32**

WesTexas wrote:
undefinedprocess wrote:Victory Commons Two & Three would be such a waste.

why?

Explained above.

Posted: **03 Jun 2021 09:46**

You all have convince me.....Perot and Hillwood are simply clueless as to what to build in the post-pandemic 21st century.

Posted: **03 Jun 2021 09:54**

citygeek wrote:You all have convince me.....Perot and Hillwood are simply clueless as to what to build in the post-pandemic 21st century.

Honestly, think it was pretty much the same way before the pandemic hit. The pandemic has only exacerbated this weakness from them. I genuinely, with everyone ounce of my being, do not understand why they are so clueless (seemingly). I understand, gotta make the investors happy, safe builds for good ROI, but like holy shit, more tissue box office buildings?
If anyone reading this uses the forum at all since I've been posting, you'd have seen how I really want the Legacy area & DNT corridor in Frisco to win. I want to see an increase in density, better planning for pedestrian access, and just verticality, you know? I think there's great potential there. But as much as I love those areas for their potential and a few projects here and there, the stuff that Hillwood and Perot are throwing at the urban core of Dallas is some Plano/Frisco ass shit. It's beyond laughable, especially now with this "post-pandemic" world we're in, or at least the approach many developers are taking.

Posted: **04 Aug 2021 20:44**

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Posted: **05 Aug 2021 13:21**

Posted: **27 Aug 2021 14:40**

Starbucks will replace Sift + Pour next to Chipotle. They started working on the interior recently.

Posted: **27 Aug 2021 16:31**

Well Victory Park ain't Bishop Arts its unlikely to maintain too much originality so that's no surprise. I am just surprised they didn't convince one of the developers in that area to let them build a drive through...

Posted: **27 Aug 2021 17:15**

Why Starbucks? There is one at the union.

Posted: **30 Aug 2021 19:40**

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Posted: **30 Aug 2021 21:05**

This is a nice little building for that tiny plot of land.

Posted: **26 Sep 2021 12:21**

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Posted: **26 Sep 2021 12:22**

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Posted: **26 Sep 2021 19:29**

Pretty nice

Posted: **27 Sep 2021 11:17**

Looks nice, a lot of dead trees already. That didn't take long.

Posted: **27 Sep 2021 17:49**

Looks ok but Hillwood and especially Perot are ignorant. They are frugal and that is why we have to settle for their uninspired/boring buildings.

Posted: **28 Sep 2021 11:04**

We are lucky they built anything here near the station. The city messed things up when they built a garage with a big blank side facing the station pathway.

Posted: **22 Oct 2021 17:20**

WFAA to move its TV studio out of prime Victory Park location in January - Dallas Morning News

The Tegna-owned ABC affiliate said it is remodeling existing space on the second floor of its 606 Young St. office, where it’s flanked by the Omni Dallas hotel and the former headquarters of The Dallas Morning News.

Posted: **24 Oct 2021 09:00**

I figured there would be a consolidation. With all the cost-cutting and anchor/reporter revolving door movements at stations Tegna owns or has acquired, I'm surprised they let Ch.8 have 2 facilities this long without moving out of one of them.

Posted: **24 Oct 2021 17:17**

itsjrd1964 wrote:I figured there would be a consolidation. With all the cost-cutting and anchor/reporter revolving door movements at stations Tegna owns or has acquired, I'm surprised they let Ch.8 have 2 facilities this long without moving out of one of them.

Dallas/Ft. Worth is the fourth largest TV market in the country. Channel 8 is owned by TENGA, while all of the other network stations are o&o by the networks themselves. You can be sure that ABC would love to own Channel 8. TENGA is a horrid operator. At some point they'll have to divest themselves of some stations. At that point, ABC will eventually buy Channel 8.

Posted: **25 Oct 2021 09:25**

rono3849 wrote:
itsjrd1964 wrote:I figured there would be a consolidation. With all the cost-cutting and anchor/reporter revolving door movements at stations Tegna owns or has acquired, I'm surprised they let Ch.8 have 2 facilities this long without moving out of one of them.

Dallas/Ft. Worth is the fourth largest TV market in the country. Channel 8 is owned by TENGA, while all of the other network stations are o&o by the networks themselves. You can be sure that ABC would love to own Channel 8. TENGA is a horrid operator. At some point they'll have to divest themselves of some stations. At that point, ABC will eventually buy Channel 8.

Why do you think TEGNA will have to divest themselves of some stations at some point?

Posted: **27 Oct 2021 21:10**

Hillwood.fence.jpg

Looks like Hillwood Urban has a new fence surrounding its property at Field & Woodall Rogers Frwy. I guess they are committed to this development for now.

Posted: **28 Oct 2021 09:38**

rono3849 wrote:
itsjrd1964 wrote:I figured there would be a consolidation. With all the cost-cutting and anchor/reporter revolving door movements at stations Tegna owns or has acquired, I'm surprised they let Ch.8 have 2 facilities this long without moving out of one of them.

Dallas/Ft. Worth is the fourth largest TV market in the country. Channel 8 is owned by TENGA, while all of the other network stations are o&o by the networks themselves. You can be sure that ABC would love to own Channel 8. TENGA is a horrid operator. At some point they'll have to divest themselves of some stations. At that point, ABC will eventually buy Channel 8.

A quick word of warning... don't do a google search for "TENGA" while you're at work :lol:

Posted: **28 Oct 2021 10:39**

homeworld1031tx wrote:
rono3849 wrote:
itsjrd1964 wrote:I figured there would be a consolidation. With all the cost-cutting and anchor/reporter revolving door movements at stations Tegna owns or has acquired, I'm surprised they let Ch.8 have 2 facilities this long without moving out of one of them.

Dallas/Ft. Worth is the fourth largest TV market in the country. Channel 8 is owned by TENGA, while all of the other network stations are o&o by the networks themselves. You can be sure that ABC would love to own Channel 8. TENGA is a horrid operator. At some point they'll have to divest themselves of some stations. At that point, ABC will eventually buy Channel 8.

HAHAHA one of my buddies used to work for what I think you're thinking of. I got sent a lot of test samples in my 20's hahahahahah
A quick word of warning... don't do a google search for "TENGA" while you're at work

Posted: **02 Nov 2021 14:44**

THRILLHO wrote:WFAA to move its TV studio out of prime Victory Park location in January - Dallas Morning News
The Tegna-owned ABC affiliate said it is remodeling existing space on the second floor of its 606 Young St. office, where it’s flanked by the Omni Dallas hotel and the former headquarters of The Dallas Morning News.

I am a little surprised they did not choose a spot near Woodall Rodgers Park... its so busy all the time would make a great backdrop.

At the same time it seems like a bit of a setback from Mavericks/Stars when I rarely watch TV News and would see that I would always think gee I should have gone to a game tonight LOL.

Its unfortunate that plaza never really turned into the public gathering place they thought it would.

Posted: **02 Nov 2021 14:45**

The Discovery District achieved what Victory Park failed to do.

If they were looking for pedestrian activity, somewhere near the Discover District would have been perfect.

Posted: **02 Nov 2021 15:56**

potatocoins wrote:The Discovery District achieved what Victory Park failed to do.

If they were looking for pedestrian activity, somewhere near the Discover District would have been perfect.

Be nice if all of that activity around Discovery eventually leads to some new towers going up close by. There are still surface lots real close.

Posted: **02 Nov 2021 15:58**

Victory Park will not reach its full potential until the gaps are filled in there and in Harwood.

Posted: **03 Nov 2021 08:25**

gshelton91 wrote:
THRILLHO wrote:WFAA to move its TV studio out of prime Victory Park location in January - Dallas Morning News
The Tegna-owned ABC affiliate said it is remodeling existing space on the second floor of its 606 Young St. office, where it’s flanked by the Omni Dallas hotel and the former headquarters of The Dallas Morning News.

I am a little surprised they did not choose a spot near Woodall Rodgers Park... its so busy all the time would make a great backdrop.

At the same time it seems like a bit of a setback from Mavericks/Stars when I rarely watch TV News and would see that I would always think gee I should have gone to a game tonight LOL.

Its unfortunate that plaza never really turned into the public gathering place they thought it would.

They are moving cause of two reasons cost of rent in Uptown/Victory and TV's studios no longer want those active backdrops of glass and the potential for random distracting audience behind them. WFAA owns a studio why pay uptown rent when you can just use the studio you already own. They have slowly made it almost impossible to see activity outside on purpose by adding equipment needed for broadcast to block the view. Do you really want to be broadcasting the news about how many people died from COVID and behind you is some dork dancing up and down waving what ever he thinks is funny at the time. TV studios are about control of sound and light and when you have a transparent studio like they did it makes those things a lot harder. The Victory Park studio was a gimmick and a number of radio shows and TV shows that used to have similar setups have renovated and either blacked out the windows or moved back to black box studios for broadcast. A lack of people walking around was preferred as it meant less movement and interruption behind the on screen talent.

Posted: **04 Nov 2021 05:32**

potatocoins wrote:The Discovery District achieved what Victory Park failed to do.

We already had pretty decent street life in EMC before the Discovery District opened, and then the food court, bars and public activities there gave everything a point of focus. Victory does not have that base level of activity and the plaza lacks things to do. The raw retail and public space and public transit to do it are there, but they have not done enough to attract the people. And people going to the arena events seem to want to get in and out in a hurry.

Posted: **04 Nov 2021 05:37**

potatocoins wrote:The Discovery District achieved what Victory Park failed to do.

We already had pretty decent street life in EMC before the Discovery District opened, and then the food court, bars and public activities there gave everything a point of focus. Victory does not have that base level of activity and the plaza lacks things to do. The raw retail and public space and public transit to do it in VP are all there, but they have struggled to attract that healthy base of people milling about. And people going to the arena events seem to want to get in and out in a hurry.

Posted: **04 Nov 2021 09:16**

That's fair. Discovery District did have a lot more going for it. I think the North End apartments need to be re-developed in order to see any real change in the pedestrian activity here, but I'm not even convinced that will change too much. Victory Park is mostly built out at this point, and the activity seems to still be very hit or miss.

Posted: **04 Nov 2021 10:43**

As someone who has lived in VP for three years, it's the most active it's ever been right now...walk the main strip with Mesero, Imoto, Billy Can Can, Jinya, etc on any night where it's nice out. Weekend nights are slammed. Hero and Happiest Hour are happening spots a couple hours before and after any game or concert.

A new restaurant from Miami, Villa Azur, just opened at the W. I would expect similar concepts to open on the ground floor of The Victor and Victory Commons within a year.

Posted: **04 Nov 2021 13:59**

dalbert wrote:As someone who has lived in VP for three years, it's the most active it's ever been right now...walk the main strip with Mesero, Imoto, Billy Can Can, Jinya, etc on any night where it's nice out. Weekend nights are slammed. Hero and Happiest Hour are happening spots a couple hours before and after any game or concert.

A new restaurant from Miami, Villa Azur, just opened at the W. I would expect similar concepts to open on the ground floor of The Victor and Victory Commons within a year.

The Victor and Victory Commons One will have ground floor retail space available for lease? Had no idea and now, I have no idea how I had no idea. That's good to know.

Posted: **04 Nov 2021 17:35**

Victory Park has decent pedestrian activity. I have always liked VP proximity to West End and the Design District. Victory Park is one of the "newer" neighborhoods too in downtown so it some time. A few years from now, I expect VP to be a lot more vibrant.

Posted: **04 Nov 2021 17:39**

Urbancowboy wrote:Victory Park has decent pedestrian activity. I have always liked VP proximity to West End and the Design District. Victory Park is one of the "newer" neighborhoods too in downtown so it some time. A few years from now, I expect VP to be a lot more vibrant.

Curious what you think will change in the next few years to cause VP to become a lot more vibrant.

Posted: **04 Nov 2021 22:53**

dalbert wrote:As someone who has lived in VP for three years, it's the most active it's ever been right now...walk the main strip with Mesero, Imoto, Billy Can Can, Jinya, etc on any night where it's nice out. Weekend nights are slammed. Hero and Happiest Hour are happening spots a couple hours before and after any game or concert.

A new restaurant from Miami, Villa Azur, just opened at the W. I would expect similar concepts to open on the ground floor of The Victor and Victory Commons within a year.

Good to hear!

Posted: **05 Nov 2021 07:57**

Yea…VP is definitely a much more vibrant spot now. It functions like a real neighborhood. It will only continue to get better as surrounding lots develop.

Posted: **05 Nov 2021 10:45**

VP will continue to attract residents and businesses because of it's desired location. I was there in the beginning and what I see now is a neighborhood that is still growing. As the Design District continues to evolve, some of that will spill-over to VP and vice-versa. VP was a "ghost-town" but not anymore. Still has a ways to go but VP has made tremendous progress the last 10 years.

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Victory Park 3.0

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