Dallas Fort Worth Urban Forum

They are building a small office building right on the Katy trail. I haven’t seen drawings but I imagine it will be similar to the one north of The McKenzie.

R1070 wrote:What is the crane on the far North end of McKinney Ave for?

Walked by yesterday. Columns coming out of ground already, so no below ground parking. Permits reference “Shelby Family Office.”

Found this on Candys Dirt https://candysdirt.com/tag/shelby-family-offices

Shelby Family Offices – McCommas at McKinney

Also bordering the Katy Trail is a new office building replacing the Atlantic National Trust building. Unlike the rest of the night’s projects, this one was a drive-by to let the OLC know what was up. A courtesy, given that it’s being built so far within its allowed zoning, it’s shocking. It’s a five-story building in an area zoned for 240-foot height.

One funny – how do I know about the Atlantic National Trust? Because the images looked so 1980s or 1990s with its rounded glass skin that I thought this was a remodel versus new construction. I’m not throwing shade on the project, it’s just the combination of its name (“family offices”), rounded edges and such a short building for the area made me wonder.

As I said, they’re not asking for anything, so there’s not much more to tell.

On The Border is closing to be redeveloped for more shopping spaces. I assume they'll tear the building down and build something shorter and closer to the street (similar to Kate Spade building)?

http://dallas.culturemap.com/news/resta ... n-closing/

I think we knew this news was coming, but it’s still kinda sad to see the original OTB shuttered.

That article is very confusing. It suggests the location will be “converted” for more retail and residential space. Sounds more like torn down and started over to me. Also the story said Z Gallerie is closing. I’m not so sure about that. It was not on the closing list last month and the employees don’t seem to aware of that. It also mentioned the departure of Abacus. I think they are just changing concepts there. I have noticed they are replacing some landscaping on that lot in the past few days.

Isn’t this block part of Michael Dell’s MDC acquisitions? Why start here? There is plenty of redevelopment opportunities on the property he also bought on Travis.

finally - why now? Isn’t Knox gonna be a construction nightmare for two years already? And this too?

The OTB and Kate Spade buildings along with their parking lots have been rumored to be redeveloped for a while now.

Z Gallerie is in a fiscal death spiral, but last I checked, the Knox store wasn't on the list of closing stores. However, it's possible that their financial distress is worsening and combined with the changing nature of Knox, a closure might now make more sense.

And yes, the Abacus closure was attributed to changing tastes (the expensive slab o' meat steakhouse concept is losing ground) but it'll re-open as something else.

Something else to watch for: the Outdoor Voices-turned-Parachute shop is only good for another 6/7 months or so (spoke with the store manager and they only did a year lease, with the goal of opening a perm store closer to downtown). The lot along with a few small buildings nearby are already for sale.

One more thing I noticed going on in Knox: the Trader Joe's redeveloped the corner of the lot it sits on to add a small dog park. We thought it was neat, and speaks to the pedestrian activity in the area--folks can drop their dogs off for a few minutes while they run into the store.

LongonBigD wrote:I think we knew this news was coming, but it’s still kinda sad to see the original OTB shuttered.

It's not actually the original. The original was a couple blocks west.

emmasensei wrote:
Something else to watch for: the Outdoor Voices-turned-Parachute shop is only good for another 6/7 months or so (spoke with the store manager and they only did a year lease, with the goal of opening a perm store closer to downtown). The lot along with a few small buildings nearby are already for sale.

I'd love to see Parachute go Downtown on Main, near all the Headington luxury retail. If some critical mass can happen down there with luxury retailers, it could solidify Downtown as a retail destination.

Hannibal Lecter wrote:

LongonBigD wrote:I think we knew this news was coming, but it’s still kinda sad to see the original OTB shuttered.

It's not actually the original. The original was a couple blocks west.

You’re right. I didn’t remember that. Today’s DMN article does imply that the building is gonna stay and be converted to retail and residential. Very interested to see how that manifests itself.

Abacus to become Jasper’s Uptown

Tabs should be less than half of the $100 per person average at Abacus, owner William "Bill" Hyde Jr. said, with starters ranging from $9 to $19 and mains from $13 to $45.

"This neighborhood has changed and fine dining has changed," Hyde said, sitting in the freshly painted dining room last week. "Millennials are now occupying the majority of the area. Now the menu is something that serves the majority of people who live here."

https://www.guidelive.com/restaurant-openings/2019/08/05/abacus-defining-dallas-restaurant-will-become-outpost-jaspers

Is Knox now Uptown too? The Uptown name has been chipping away at adjoining neighborhoods for years. It’s better to have areas with their own strong identities, rather than lumping everything into one big generic Uptown name.

Resturants may be claiming Uptown but not all apartment properties are claiming Uptown. Since Uptown got the party town emphasis leasing staff at many properties sell this area as a nicer quieter alternative to Uptown. I've personally experienced prospects asking not to be in Uptown cause its too much in price and activity. More like Uptown adjacent with easy access to Uptown, Oak Lawn, Henderson, Mockingbird Station, etc.

CB2 will apparently be opening September 20.

Demolition has finally started on the buildings at Hester and Mckinney for that apartment complex that still hasn't gotten its final designs approved by the Oak Lawn committee yet.

Please correct me if I’m wrong (because I’m not totally certain by any means), but I was under the impression that they didn’t need the OLC’s approval to build here? I thought it was more of the developer attempting to be courteous than anything else. The area I’m pretty sure is zoned for up to 240’ high.

khres wrote:

LongonBigD wrote:

khres wrote:Stockdale owns the stretch from Kozy to Knox Street Pub, and with all those closing there must be some redevelopment plans. They also own a significant portion of the block on the east side of McKinney

http://stockdale.com/properties/texas/knox-promenade

That’s good information. Thanks.

I am optimistic the change will be much better. Stockdale has been upping their tenant list as spaces are re-leased. I think I would like to see a tear down and redo to fix walking and to further extend retail south on McKinney. I guess we wait and see.

A little more digging yielded this rendering and listing on loopnet. Angle is from the corner of McKinney and Armstrong looking to the south-west. Not an earth shattering redevelopment, but definitely better than what is currently there.


https://www.loopnet.com/Listing/4433-4447-McKinney-Ave-Dallas-TX/14487883/

I wonder if this proposed center has changed? That link to loopnet says the property is no longer listed on their site. Is it possible somebody had a better idea and will take better advantage of the sites location and potential?

cowboyeagle05 wrote:Demolition has finally started on the buildings at Hester and Mckinney for that apartment complex that still hasn't gotten its final designs approved by the Oak Lawn committee yet.

RIP my old condo! It was a great location, a nice unit, and cashing out when they bought out the building didn't hurt either

cowboyeagle05 wrote:Demolition has finally started on the buildings at Hester and Mckinney for that apartment complex that still hasn't gotten its final designs approved by the Oak Lawn committee yet.

According to this DMN article, the building will be 5 stories tall with one level of underground parking.

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/real-estate/2019/09/05/more-apartments-on-the-way-near-dallas-knox-street-retail-district/

It’s happening. So close. So excited!

Such a high-end boutique traditional space for a store that prides itself on being more modern and contemporary.

It’s definitely an interesting choice of building.

cowboyeagle05 wrote:Such a high-end boutique traditional space for a store that prides itself on being more modern and contemporary.

I agree. I thought they might at least put a false fascia on the building.

Glad they left the trees. I always thought this building would be a great restaurant space with that outdoor area shaded and right on McKinney Ave. The patio will be very inviting and will probably help them sell some outdoor furniture.

Moved this posting to the "Knox: Armstrong and Cole" string, but the pictures stayed. I guess just to tease you to look at the other string!!

Wow, this looks pretty great. If the building can't be mixed-use, this is certainly the next best option.

Walked past the old On the Border on Knox St. It’s being painted on the outside to look less like a Mexican restaurant.

It appears they have divided the space into three future retail spaces. Probably smart right now. Sign short term leases and buy some time to allow the dust to settle on the (future) new RH and Weirs Plaza. Once those are wildly successful and Knox street redo is done, announce your own large mixed-use project.

The largest space has “Now Hiring” signs up. It is going to be a Yeti store. Didn’t know that was a thing.

LongonBigD wrote:The largest space has “Now Hiring” signs up. It is going to be a Yeti store. Didn’t know that was a thing.

I think Yeti's flagship store in Austin does well enough that they're now taking the concept nationwide. They just opened a retail outlet in Charleston. Knox Street is the ideal location for something like this.

https://gearjunkie.com/yeti-charleston-store

Away Suitcases is going in next to Follain. The evolution of Knox is getting really interesting. There are neighborhoods in other cities that really attract lots of these formerly internet-only, Millennial-focused brands (the Seaport in Boston being a prime example) and lots of temporary and experimental popups from foreign brands looking to get a toehold in the US.

I've also heard rumors of a Glossier and Everlane on the way, but those are totally unsubstantiated, while Away is a definite (signs are already on the doors).

Yeti signs are up and store appears almost fully stocked with merchandise. Guessing the opening is imminent.

Here are some pics on the construction progress on Travis!!!

Thanks for the pics. It’s hard to see what’s happening on those two projects due to the fencing.

The Weirs pic is a great look at all that is left if Highland Park Soda Fountain building (two walls). The uproar on Nextdoor about this borders on ridiculousness. Most commentators are appalled and feel “tricked” by the developers. I guess they thought they were going to save the building and only refurbish it. Clearly those people never got an up close look at what that building had deteriorated to before demo. It was in horrible shape due to years of neglect. I can’t believe that we’re able to save what they did.

As to the “evil, trickster developers” I guess these complainers don’t understand that the Weir Family has controlled this for decades and are entitled to do what they wish with the property. I thought it was a nice gesture on their part to save the exterior and incorporate its replacement into the project.

Great shots! And the idiots on NextDoor are for the most part just that; idiots.

NextDoor is full of hysteria. It's hard to read most of those comments from people that know about 1% of what's going on.

Couldn't disagree more with the comments above re: HP Soda Fountain building. The developer knew what they were doing when they said they would "preserve" the building, specifically the exterior. Instead, what they did was some form of "facadism" not "preservation."

I'm well-aware of this issue, and the folks involved on the development (including the Weir family) knew exactly what they were doing. People in Dallas tried to work with them for years on a preservation plan of some sort for the building (including plans that would not have interfered with their high-rise), but they had no interest.

Where they crossed the line, IMO, was by deliberately telling the preservation community that they would "preserve" the HP portion of the project as a way of avoiding entanglement with the City's Landmark Commission. That tactic may have been successful, but it cost some of those involved in this project a lot of credibility that had been built up over the years from past projects. Sad.

The area north of Fitzugh and east of the Katy Trail and west of 75 I think is ripe for large mid and high rise dense development. I am all for it and especially extend the streetcar and someday open up the Knox DART station. Dallas needs a dense urban core to compete with the suburban areas by offering something they can not a true big city experience and lifestyle. I hope all surrounding neighborhoods around downtown end up with this dense development. Build up not out.

Grange Hall is moving to Fitzhugh. It will occupy the same shopping center as Beverly's.

https://www.dallasnews.com/food/restaur ... gh-avenue/

Interesting. There's some shuffling afoot in Knox--a popup for a Nantucket shoe store opened next to Yeti in the former On the Border building, and Stag Provisions is moving from across the street into that same building as well. No idea what will replace Stag.

It's news to me that the Weir's tower will host a WeWork. I tried to make WeWork work (heh) for me earlier this year but the two DFW locations I visited were kind of a mess. Why are they still trying to expand so aggressively, given all the corporate chaos? The NYT podcast did a deep dive on the WeWork mess just this morning.

Funny, I just listened to that podcast! How WeWork can still be expanding is beyond me. I would be surprised if they exist at all by the time Weir's tower is complete.

So that apartment project they announced for the site at McKinney and Hester next door to Knox Heights well its still just an empty plot of land. They tore all the old condo buildings down and left up the construction fence and haven't touched the site since. Just FYI.

cowboyeagle05 wrote:So that apartment project they announced for the site at McKinney and Hester next door to Knox Heights well its still just an empty plot of land. They tore all the old condo buildings down and left up the construction fence and haven't touched the site since. Just FYI.

Super easy to get a demo permit (non-historic demo of course) in Dallas but it could take a year to get a building permit, especially if there is platting/easements/alley abandonment involved, which is very likely the situation here.

I still don't think they got everything approved for the final design even if it was under their permitted zoning.

Knox Oliver tower (Nove at Knox) was well over a year between demo of existing and construction start, maybe almost two years

Progress Pic

That will be an enormous underground garage!

Interesting that Weirs has a 6story hole in the ground while A block away RH has a few concrete stubs sticking out of the ground (no underground anything planned here). I think they demoed at right around the same time.

I go to Knox nearly every day and lately I'm always surprised by just how much pedestrian activity there is, even though all the construction and sidewalk gaps make it a bit of a nightmare. Love seeing what this area is evolving into.

Thank goodness the city isn't doing the Knox Street complete street redo yet.

The utility work they're doing that frequently has the street ripped up, plus the construction, is disruption enough! haha

From Dallas News:
https://www.dallasnews.com/business/rea ... -district/

“Austin billionaire Michael Dell has added to his holdings in Dallas’ Knox Street district. The Dell family’s MSD Capital LP has acquired a block of buildings along Buena Vista Street just south of Knox. One of the buildings was formerly used by Weir’s Furniture as a warehouse.

MSD Capital has been working with Dallas-based Retail Connection on long-term redevelopment plans for many of the properties. Knox Street and the surrounding neighborhood has become one of Dallas’ hottest development areas.”

Now, how about a lot less talk and a little more action! Get this project on Travis going already.