Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

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Tivo_Kenevil
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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 12 Aug 2020 23:01

The bridge was finally lit up. It looks amazing

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby DPatel304 » 04 Jan 2021 11:58

Repairs Set to Begin for Margaret McDermott Pedestrian Bridge
Repairs are estimated to be completed by the end of the year, the city manager's office says

https://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/repai ... e/2518590/

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casperitl
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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby casperitl » 04 Jan 2021 12:29

^ In the story linked in the post above it looks like the concrete sections are at different elevations? I have never been on the pedestrian section due to the closure and I'm wondering if this is a messed up deck or a feature? Seems dangerous given the uneven pavement.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby DPatel304 » 04 Jan 2021 12:44

casperitl wrote:^ In the story linked in the post above it looks like the concrete sections are at different elevations? I have never been on the pedestrian section due to the closure and I'm wondering if this is a messed up deck or a feature? Seems dangerous given the uneven pavement.


You're right, that didn't stick out to me when I first saw the article.

I have to assume it is intentionally, because it looks too perfect to be an unintentional mess up. My guess is, is that they are trying to separate bikes and pedestrians? If that's the case, there needs to be a better separation between the two.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby THRILLHO » 04 Jan 2021 16:55

I am genuinely gobsmacked to see that elevated portion. What on earth were they trying to do that couldn't have been done with a painted white line that has no risk of tripping anyone or sending a bike flying.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby Tnexster » 04 Jan 2021 17:00

To me it looks like a total screw up. That can't be intentional design.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby soco » 05 Jan 2021 08:50

The separation is intentional. The original signage and striping plan has cyclists and pedestrians in their own spaces on the approaches and on the bridge itself. On the bridge pedestrians transition to the raised portion while cyclists continue in their own 'bike lane'.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby DPatel304 » 05 Jan 2021 09:13

soco wrote:The separation is intentional. The original signage and striping plan has cyclists and pedestrians in their own spaces on the approaches and on the bridge itself. On the bridge pedestrians transition to the raised portion while cyclists continue in their own 'bike lane'.


I really hope they plan to make the two lanes different colors or perhaps add some other sort of separator as well. Otherwise I could definitely see it being a bit dangerous if it's not noticeable.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby TNWE » 12 Jan 2021 11:04

DPatel304 wrote:
soco wrote:The separation is intentional. The original signage and striping plan has cyclists and pedestrians in their own spaces on the approaches and on the bridge itself. On the bridge pedestrians transition to the raised portion while cyclists continue in their own 'bike lane'.


I really hope they plan to make the two lanes different colors or perhaps add some other sort of separator as well. Otherwise I could definitely see it being a bit dangerous if it's not noticeable.


Maybe the modifications will include traffic-calming measures like curb bumpouts and speed tables to keep cyclists from going dangerously fast so close to pedestrians. We need to slow things down so no one gets hurt, after all ;) :lol:

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 18 Jan 2021 15:02

I bet Mr. Santiago Calatrava has a contractual ban of painted symbols or painted concrete to try to organize the types of traffic. His style is bright white everything... He already threw a fit when the city talked about colorful LED lighting for the bridge. The problem with high profile Celeb-Architects is cities are so desperate to have their trophies on the skyline they are likely to bend to their celebrity requests no matter what they are.
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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby Tnexster » 27 Jan 2021 17:05

Happened across this bridge a couple times today. At least work is being done.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby DPatel304 » 27 Jan 2021 18:59

Wonderful. Even though I'm really embarrassed by how much of a cluster this project has been, I'm looking forward to utilizing this pedestrian bridge when it is completed.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby ajderry2017 » 29 Jan 2021 22:42

cowboyeagle05 wrote:I bet Mr. Santiago Calatrava has a contractual ban of painted symbols or painted concrete to try to organize the types of traffic. His style is bright white everything... He already threw a fit when the city talked about colorful LED lighting for the bridge. The problem with high profile Celeb-Architects is cities are so desperate to have their trophies on the skyline they are likely to bend to their celebrity requests no matter what they are.


After construction is done, do you think it’s too late to add some sort of lights on the bridges? Is the council in favor of it?

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 30 Jan 2021 09:02

ajderry2017 wrote:
cowboyeagle05 wrote:I bet Mr. Santiago Calatrava has a contractual ban of painted symbols or painted concrete to try to organize the types of traffic. His style is bright white everything... He already threw a fit when the city talked about colorful LED lighting for the bridge. The problem with high profile Celeb-Architects is cities are so desperate to have their trophies on the skyline they are likely to bend to their celebrity requests no matter what they are.


After construction is done, do you think it’s too late to add some sort of lights on the bridges? Is the council in favor of it?


There's regular lightning already on the bridge. It makes it look bright white at night. It's very, very rare that they switch it on. Ive seen on like twice during existence. I live nearby see it everyday and night.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby Tnexster » 24 May 2021 10:49

The Margaret McDermott Bridge Will Finally Open to Pedestrians Next Month
It's four years late and $7 million over budget, but you can soon walk or bike over the Trinity River along the Margaret McDermott Bridge.

https://www.dmagazine.com/frontburner/2 ... ext-month/

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby quixomniac » 24 May 2021 17:32

Tnexster wrote:The Margaret McDermott Bridge Will Finally Open to Pedestrians Next Month
It's four years late and $7 million over budget, but you can soon walk or bike over the Trinity River along the Margaret McDermott Bridge.

https://www.dmagazine.com/frontburner/2 ... ext-month/


Wow. alot earlier than i thought it would. Y'all go on ahead. Ill check it out in july if it doesnt collapse. :lol:

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby undefinedprocess » 24 May 2021 19:49

quixomniac wrote:
Tnexster wrote:The Margaret McDermott Bridge Will Finally Open to Pedestrians Next Month
It's four years late and $7 million over budget, but you can soon walk or bike over the Trinity River along the Margaret McDermott Bridge.

https://www.dmagazine.com/frontburner/2 ... ext-month/


Wow. alot earlier than i thought it would. Y'all go on ahead. Ill check it out in july if it doesnt collapse. :lol:

Hmm… Do y’all think it being open will last..?

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby THRILLHO » 10 Jun 2021 18:42

Today was the ceremony day, so it is now officially, finally open.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby quixomniac » 10 Jun 2021 23:16

Went to check it out.
0FA4918C-9536-4A5C-A671-DAE01C8AA4C3.jpeg

Word of advice, go up from the west levee, Oak cliff side.
In general access to the bridge is terrible, poor interaction with the levees.
But the East levee, downtown side, is beyond terrible!
One arch ends at a dead end, near an off ramp.
22E3D9E8-92BD-4673-9B35-2E446C409A08.jpeg

And the other end is attached to an on ramp! Wtf.
F17AE924-6D9A-4A8D-B167-45B4321F91F1.jpeg

It looks like they left a space for a future bike ramp attachment in the future.
AF5E2E16-7604-4DFD-8186-95F169EBADA9.jpeg
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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby quixomniac » 10 Jun 2021 23:20

undefinedprocess wrote:Hmm… Do y’all think it being open will last..?


I’d give it a few weeks before they close it.
There are already people taking pictures hanging over the edge. :shock:
It’s only a matter of time b4 someone gets hurt accidentally or on purpose
And they’ll have to close it to put some netting to prevent falls.
Which honestly I’m shocked that no one had the foresight to put in the first place!
6614213F-EC85-4D93-A684-CC515696D99B.jpeg
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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby potatocoins » 11 Jun 2021 09:13

:shock: Why are people climbing over the edge?? Ugh..

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby undefinedprocess » 11 Jun 2021 10:28

potatocoins wrote::shock: Why are people climbing over the edge?? Ugh..

Ugh is right. This going to get closed again so quick. I'm a photographer so I care way more about "the shot" than many people, but nah... You'd never catch me doing this. Someone going to play around and fall.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 16 Jun 2021 17:31

Hey remember the only reason we have the arches is because the Obama admin was giving out checks for projects that included other transportation besides more cars. Next the super smart Dallas Trinity Project people said what if we add overpriced Santiago Calatrava arches to a highway bridge so that it looks fancier like the one we promised in concept renderings. The arches will be "pedestrian bridges" so we can say look we care about alternative transportation. Then the rich people said deal I will write a check for my name to be slapped on the thing despite such a check only pays for the name plaque and we can forget we even created that Trinity River Rapids thing that could kill people...
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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby Tnexster » 29 Jun 2021 11:46

So is anybody using the walkways?

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby potatocoins » 29 Jun 2021 12:01

I haven't personally used them yet (way too hot), but I've seen pictures posted on Reddit of people biking on them.

I'll likely go check them out myself when the weather is a bit more mild.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 29 Jun 2021 19:34

Tnexster wrote:So is anybody using the walkways?

Yeah I've used em. They're alright, kinda a luxury. it's rather noisy but the views are nice. I posted some picks on the discord server. The infrastructure, sidewalks to reach the walkways don't even exist on beckley. So half assed in typical Dallas fashion.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 30 Jun 2021 12:04

Hey they only exist because the Dallas elite wanted a Santiago copy on the skyline as a trophy not because anyone working on the project cared if it was a good place for a pedestrian or bike crossing.
“Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell”

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby quixomniac » 02 Jul 2021 17:26

Tivo_Kenevil wrote:Yeah I've used em. They're alright, kinda a luxury. it's rather noisy but the views are nice. I posted some picks on the discord server. The infrastructure, sidewalks to reach the walkways don't even exist on beckley. So half assed in typical Dallas fashion.

Sidewalks to the walkways on Beckley?
There are NO walkways on the Riverfront end. Nothing. None existent.
It renders that side of the bridge useless to anyone other than bikers riding in crowds to protect themselves from speeding cars to get onto the bridge ramps.

My thinking for the sidewalks on Beckley, they dont want people parking in the immediate area, trespassing on other property to get on the walkway. Just park at Trinity Overlook park and walk on the levees. It's manageable. I figure they are waiting on someone building something on those empty/abandoned lots before they bother with sidewalks.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 02 Jul 2021 18:47

quixomniac wrote:
Tivo_Kenevil wrote:Yeah I've used em. They're alright, kinda a luxury. it's rather noisy but the views are nice. I posted some picks on the discord server. The infrastructure, sidewalks to reach the walkways don't even exist on beckley. So half assed in typical Dallas fashion.

Sidewalks to the walkways on Beckley?
There are NO walkways on the Riverfront end. Nothing. None existent.
It renders that side of the bridge useless to anyone other than bikers riding in crowds to protect themselves from speeding cars to get onto the bridge ramps.

My thinking for the sidewalks on Beckley, they dont want people parking in the immediate area, trespassing on other property to get on the walkway. Just park at Trinity Overlook park and walk on the levees. It's manageable. I figure they are waiting on someone building something on those empty/abandoned lots before they bother with sidewalks.

I suppose funds ran out or Dallas didn't realize that to use a Walkway... YOU HAVE TO BE ABLE TO WALK THERE! Novel concept

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby electricron » 05 Jul 2021 08:57

quixomniac wrote:
Tivo_Kenevil wrote:My thinking for the sidewalks on Beckley, they dont want people parking in the immediate area, trespassing on other property to get on the walkway. Just park at Trinity Overlook park and walk on the levees. It's manageable. I figure they are waiting on someone building something on those empty/abandoned lots before they bother with sidewalks.

The walkways or paths on the levees stretch all the way from Corinth to West Loop 12, a distance many miles long.
The City is not ever going to build anything on land they do not own. Empty lots are usually owned by somebody other than the City.
Never-the-less, the City should encourage these property owners to build the sidewalks on their land. It does look unplanned and unfinished for sidewalks to exist on one property along a street but not on the very next property. More should be done.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby soco » 06 Jul 2021 08:56

There are several projects in the pipeline that will address all the connectivity issues being raised here.

Riverfront will be rebuilt from Cadiz to the UP railroad bridge, and will have a similar cross-section as the section near Continental. I'm not the biggest fan of the design but it will include accommodations for bikes/peds and connections to the Bridge.

The Coombs Creek Trail will be extended eastward, cross Beckley, and connect to the Beckley access ramps to the Bridge.

As redevelopment occurs along Beckley, south of I30, the developers are required to construct wide sidewalks and what is intended to be a two-way cycle track on the east side of Beckley. You can already see this beginning to take shape with the new apartments at Beckley and Oregon. The deep setback is for a wide sidewalk and two-way cycle track. As more sites redevelop more sections of the sidewalk/cycle track will be completed.

City and County staff have been working on these projects for years, and they are finally getting close to the construction phase.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby potatocoins » 06 Jul 2021 11:13

Thanks for sharing, that all sounds good to me. We're still in the very early stages of this area being re-developed, but I'm glad some forethought is being put into all of this to make it more bike/pedestrian friendly.

I honestly expected this type of transformation to happen around the Ronald Kirk Pedestrian Bridge shortly after that opened up, but that doesn't seem to have had much of an impact on the developing area (at least not that I have noticed).

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby undefinedprocess » 06 Jul 2021 13:59

potatocoins wrote:Thanks for sharing, that all sounds good to me. We're still in the very early stages of this area being re-developed, but I'm glad some forethought is being put into all of this to make it more bike/pedestrian friendly.

I honestly expected this type of transformation to happen around the Ronald Kirk Pedestrian Bridge shortly after that opened up, but that doesn't seem to have had much of an impact on the developing area (at least not that I have noticed).

Not as of yet, but I think that "impact" will come as Trinity Groves densifies and goes vertical. I'd expect any development around there to try and tie in/connect to it.

And agreed, glad to see some forethought. Hopefully it actually comes to fruition.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 07 Jul 2021 12:49

Look at it this way yes we could have built miles of walkway along the levees with a lot of political wrangling before a single apartment building went vertical but it would have been complained about as being wasteful for an area that will never be valuable land etc. When they first built the first Calatrava bridge I heard so much family complaining about building a bridge to nowhere. So instead we waited until development actually showed up and now we can stich development together with a plan for sidewalks that connect actual places people are starting to live. Honestly we can be upset on either side of the coin here. Either way some of us are gonna be upset and annoyed the city didn't do its job fast enough or wasted tax money on trails for bikers when the roads are so bad through here.
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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby potatocoins » 07 Jul 2021 13:51

undefinedprocess wrote:Not as of yet, but I think that "impact" will come as Trinity Groves densifies and goes vertical. I'd expect any development around there to try and tie in/connect to it.


I was just expecting at least some more development on the Design District side. I do agree though, it is definitely coming and I'm glad this pedestrian bridge is finally complete too.

cowboyeagle05 wrote:Look at it this way yes we could have built miles of walkway along the levees with a lot of political wrangling before a single apartment building went vertical but it would have been complained about as being wasteful for an area that will never be valuable land etc. When they first built the first Calatrava bridge I heard so much family complaining about building a bridge to nowhere. So instead we waited until development actually showed up and now we can stich development together with a plan for sidewalks that connect actual places people are starting to live. Honestly we can be upset on either side of the coin here. Either way some of us are gonna be upset and annoyed the city didn't do its job fast enough or wasted tax money on trails for bikers when the roads are so bad through here.


That's a good point. While I am impatient, I think it makes sense to let development occur naturally and build the pedestrian infrastructure gradually over time rather than doing it all up front and waiting 10+ years for the development to actually come to the area.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby tamtagon » 07 Jul 2021 14:45

The views of downtown will make south bank development an easy sell.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby Hannibal Lecter » 07 Jul 2021 15:16

tamtagon wrote:The views of downtown will make south bank development an easy sell.


I recently looked at a townhome on Greenbriar, just north of Zang. The property was directly adjacent to the Trinity corridor -- there was no way anyone could ever build between you and the river. Every level had windows and/or a patio facing downtown. It should have been fantastic. But it only had a narrow view across the river because of the trees on the city's side of the property line. And you know what the chances are of ever getting the city's permission to legally remove them -- zero.

We passed.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby I45Tex » 30 Nov 2023 19:35

The McDermott Bridge looks a lot better than this busybusy thing under construction in Miami: https://www.wsp.com/en-us/insights/2021 ... yed-bridge

With two more legs on that one I would have assumed it was the spider and that the building next door was the tuffet (as in the nursery rhyme).

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby IcedCowboyCoffee » 01 Dec 2023 10:01

Hmm well I'll say from a design perspective the Miami one is more interesting to me. It's evocative of a water fountain, and as you say a spider. The McDermott bridge isn't evocative of anything, which I think is a bigger sin. I literally feel nothing any time I see it. It's not large enough to inspire awe, it's not interesting enough to inspire curiosity or contemplation. It hardly asks for more than a second of one's attention, like it's actively trying to disappear into the background. And when passing across the bridge the two arches feel comically distant from each other, making them feel unrelated to themselves and the unrelated to the bridge itself (which is accurate at least).

I'm still bummed the original design never got to materialize.
mcdermott.JPG


But hey, it doesn't bother me too much because we got the Margaret Hunt Hill Bridge which I think is a legitimately solid design. I'm pretty happy with that one. It instantly became an enduring part of Dallas's iconography in a way that the Mcdermott bridge cannot.

I'll say this about the Miami thing though, they really are just slapping that thing on top of an elevated highway lol, which, sure, an elevated highway is always technically a bridge, but if that's the trend going forward I say screw it let's toss on a bunch of random arches on every part of our elevated highway system :lol: Leave no piece of elevated highway un-arched.
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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby I45Tex » 02 Dec 2023 18:08

Yes, had not thought of it like that. So where would you like to put the first / original design now? Maybe I-345? ;)

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby tamtagon » 02 Dec 2023 21:50

McDermott bridge design is pleasantly utilitarian, beautiful, the function is ridiculous.

The flood way corridor needs at least one more of these signature public art bridges. An odd number of structures is ideal.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby Hannibal Lecter » 04 Dec 2023 16:10

Still the classiest, best looking bridge over the Trinity.

Image

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby LongonBigD » 04 Dec 2023 20:29

tamtagon wrote:The flood way corridor needs at least one more of these signature public art bridges. An odd number of structures is ideal.


Something almost poetic about a third, modern signature bridge over the Trinity.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby itsjrd1964 » 05 Dec 2023 06:02

If there were a planned/funded 3rd bridge, IMO the logical spot would have been I-35E's crossing of the Trinity. But oh well.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby vman » 06 Dec 2023 07:23

tamtagon wrote:McDermott bridge design is pleasantly utilitarian, beautiful, the function is ridiculous.

The flood way corridor needs at least one more of these signature public art bridges. An odd number of structures is ideal.


I think McDermott looks ok from a distance, but driving across it, you feel and see absolutely nothing. It's just feels like another stretch of freeway.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby undefinedprocess » 25 Feb 2024 12:44

itsjrd1964 wrote:If there were a planned/funded 3rd bridge, IMO the logical spot would have been I-35E's crossing of the Trinity. But oh well.

Would have to agree with this, and have really wanted such a thing to come to fruition. Would be very curious to see what sort of design would come about for such a project. Kinda feel like it'd need to be another Calatrava to go with the other two... Real issue then becomes finding another Margaret... :lol:

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby itsjrd1964 » 25 Feb 2024 15:07

undefinedprocess wrote:
itsjrd1964 wrote:If there were a planned/funded 3rd bridge, IMO the logical spot would have been I-35E's crossing of the Trinity. But oh well.

Would have to agree with this, and have really wanted such a thing to come to fruition. Would be very curious to see what sort of design would come about for such a project. Kinda feel like it'd need to be another Calatrava to go with the other two... Real issue then becomes finding another Margaret... :lol:


I read somewhere that one of the wives in the Crow family is named Margaret.

Initially, I would suggest a style similar to the I-30 bridge, but with all the trouble it had getting going, IDK...

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby CTroyMathis » 25 Feb 2024 17:18

undefinedprocess wrote:
itsjrd1964 wrote:If there were a planned/funded 3rd bridge, IMO the logical spot would have been I-35E's crossing of the Trinity. But oh well.

Would have to agree with this, and have really wanted such a thing to come to fruition. Would be very curious to see what sort of design would come about for such a project. Kinda feel like it'd need to be another Calatrava to go with the other two... Real issue then becomes finding another Margaret... :lol:


There you go.

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Re: Margaret McDermott Bridge by Santiago Calatrava

Postby The_Overdog » 29 Feb 2024 09:05

Can I be less than 100% classy and say that double bridge looks like a Margret's bust? They could widen it at the bottom at AC/DC that sucker.