Dallas Fort Worth Urban Forum

Silver Line

User avatar
TNWE
Posts: 182
Joined: 03 May 2017 09:42

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby TNWE » 24 Jan 2019 11:15

The main issue with this idea is that it requires significant aerial construction at both the DFW and Plano ends, full overhead electrification, and (most difficult) closing the Cotton Belt line to all freight traffic. Right now, DART owns the ROW and makes money leasing track capacity to freight railroads that serve businesses along the line. Even after building out stations and starting passenger service, DART isn't allowed to sever the freight connections unless all current users agree to it. If they can't close the line to freight, they can't run LRT on the existing track (DART SLRVs are not FRA compliant like the Stadler DMUs, and would get absolutely crushed by a freight loco in a crash), which means building a new, at least partially elevated viaduct to carry DART LRT over the existing freight track where there are turnouts or the ROW is too narrow to fit an additional 2 tracks. That means the existing environmental approval goes out the window and we're back to square 1.

I agree that DART needs a radial loop, but at this point they might as well just tunnel under loop 12 or 635 for the LRT loop. The Cotton Belt alignment makes the most sense as Commuter Rail, and given that the CityLine development has taken off, it makes sense to reroute the tracks to make that a connecting hub. That's why Richardson put up the money for rerouting the line so it would directly connect to a major employment center (BTW, still waiting on Dallas to cough up the extra half a billion dollars they're making DART spend on D2).

I45Tex
Posts: 223
Joined: 26 Jan 2017 05:52

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby I45Tex » 24 Jan 2019 16:05

Delightfully detailed feedback, thanks! I'm glad the regulations exist, too, but it's frustrating if or when digging a hole for a bunch of concrete underneath the Trinity floodplain becomes the best shot we have.

User avatar
exelone31
Posts: 485
Joined: 31 Oct 2016 11:35

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby exelone31 » 25 Jan 2019 09:13

I'm sure this is mentioned in plans somewhere, but is the North Lake station planned to be within walking/scootering distance of Cypress Waters? I've seen maps that mention a Cypress Waters alternative, but that seems to be a pretty compelling spot to have a station.

User avatar
muncien
Posts: 950
Joined: 25 Oct 2016 08:46
Location: Cypress Waters

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby muncien » 25 Jan 2019 10:04

exelone31 wrote:I'm sure this is mentioned in plans somewhere, but is the North Lake station planned to be within walking/scootering distance of Cypress Waters? I've seen maps that mention a Cypress Waters alternative, but that seems to be a pretty compelling spot to have a station.


If I remember correctly, Billingsly has agreed to kick in money to pay for the track diversion to put a station on Cypress Waters (and Dallas) property. That said, it would be a later phase of Cypress Waters and not by the development going on today. They are all going to be connected by trails along the lake, so it's not difficult for scooter/bike usage. It should also be walkable due to the pedestrian friendly streets incorporated into Cypress Waters, but the distance will likely limit who will actually walk.
"He doesn't know how to use the three seashells..."

User avatar
tamtagon
Site Admin
Posts: 1703
Joined: 16 Oct 2016 12:04

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby tamtagon » 25 Jan 2019 10:23

^Considering the remarkable financial gift from the city of Dallas, Cypress Waters should pay for the outstanding pedestrian-train infrastructure so this development becomes walking distance to the airport.

User avatar
TNWE
Posts: 182
Joined: 03 May 2017 09:42

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby TNWE » 25 Jan 2019 10:30

muncien wrote:
exelone31 wrote:I'm sure this is mentioned in plans somewhere, but is the North Lake station planned to be within walking/scootering distance of Cypress Waters? I've seen maps that mention a Cypress Waters alternative, but that seems to be a pretty compelling spot to have a station.


If I remember correctly, Billingsly has agreed to kick in money to pay for the track diversion to put a station on Cypress Waters (and Dallas) property. That said, it would be a later phase of Cypress Waters and not by the development going on today. They are all going to be connected by trails along the lake, so it's not difficult for scooter/bike usage. It should also be walkable due to the pedestrian friendly streets incorporated into Cypress Waters, but the distance will likely limit who will actually walk.


I wouldn't be surprised if Billingsly set up a free circulator shuttle like what KDC did at CityLine.

User avatar
muncien
Posts: 950
Joined: 25 Oct 2016 08:46
Location: Cypress Waters

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby muncien » 25 Jan 2019 11:29

TNWE wrote:I wouldn't be surprised if Billingsly set up a free circulator shuttle like what KDC did at CityLine.


They already have this electric, stretched, open air, golf cart that shuttles people around during lunch time. I wouldn't be surprised to see it's usage expanded as Cypress Waters continues to build out. It seems to get decent usage, and helps limit lunch time vehicular traffic. I dig it...

There was also a stand alone bike share available when the development first kicked off, but it got very little traction and was removed. Surprisingly, none of the new dockless options were every distributed here. I think they would do well. If V-bikes is still going, I'd love for them to fill that void. Scooters are welcome too.

Those would all be great options to make a Cotton Belt line more accessible.
"He doesn't know how to use the three seashells..."

User avatar
The_Overdog
Posts: 430
Joined: 21 Oct 2016 14:55

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby The_Overdog » 20 Feb 2019 16:03

Am I missing something, or did this vote just turn the Cotton Belt from a single-track commuter line to a traditional commuter line like the rest of DART?


https://communityimpact.com/dallas-fort ... s-suburbs/

"he Dallas Area Rapid Transit board of directors unanimously approved adding the double track along the entirety of the future east-west running railway at its Feb. 12 meeting. The design change is expected to eventually reduce the wait period between rail cars to under 20 minutes for both directions."

Double track means a E-> West line and a W->East that are parallel and separate right?

User avatar
northsouth
Posts: 50
Joined: 26 Oct 2016 18:59

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby northsouth » 20 Feb 2019 19:18

The line was designed as double-tracked, and that it would be fully double-tracked either from the start or down the road. The argument is that doing it later would be relatively more expensive and difficult than to just do it now for an increased initial cost. This is talked about in the presentation given to the DART board: https://www.dart.org/about/board/boarda ... 2feb19.pdf

As far as I remember, most public discussions mentioned the line as double-tracked, and it actually caught me off guard a little bit that they had to officially make it fully double-tracked afterwards instead of being the default. And yes, double track means two separate tracks, one for each direction, but with crossovers here and there to allow for trains to go around blockages.

itsjrd1964
Posts: 657
Joined: 28 Jul 2018 07:38

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby itsjrd1964 » 20 Feb 2019 21:43

This would put it on par with all the DART light rail lines. All of them are doubled. Too bad we don't yet have the TRE or TexRail as a double-track setup. They will need it sooner than later.

User avatar
The_Overdog
Posts: 430
Joined: 21 Oct 2016 14:55

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby The_Overdog » 21 Feb 2019 09:21

As far as I remember, most public discussions mentioned the line as double-tracked, and it actually caught me off guard a little bit that they had to officially make it fully double-tracked afterwards instead of being the default.


That's odd, because double-tracking was part of the 2045 rail plan even after the Cotton Belt line had been approved. Single track with 30 minute+ waits has always been my main complaint with this line. I'm glad they are spending the extra (minor for 26 miles of rail) amount of money now.

User avatar
Matt777
Posts: 668
Joined: 28 Oct 2016 09:10

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby Matt777 » 21 Feb 2019 14:05

How much extra is double tracking going to add to the cost of this epic boondoggle?

If they're going to be spending all this extra money to bring a 3rd rail line to DFW Airport, I would like to see a plan to integrate the 3 lines into one central station at DFW, and then buses from each terminal to "DFW Airport Central Rail Station." Users could get info and buy tickets from one station and then enter a numbered platform area like the ones in other parts of the globe.

User avatar
muncien
Posts: 950
Joined: 25 Oct 2016 08:46
Location: Cypress Waters

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby muncien » 21 Feb 2019 15:36

Matt777 wrote:How much extra is double tracking going to add to the cost of this epic boondoggle?

If they're going to be spending all this extra money to bring a 3rd rail line to DFW Airport, I would like to see a plan to integrate the 3 lines into one central station at DFW, and then buses from each terminal to "DFW Airport Central Rail Station." Users could get info and buy tickets from one station and then enter a numbered platform area like the ones in other parts of the globe.


Isn't that the plan? I mean, unless you call that short walk between DART and Texrail significant enough to make them two stations. Or, are they now talking about stopping Cotton Belt at the DFW 'North' station? Maybe I missed that update...
"He doesn't know how to use the three seashells..."

User avatar
ContriveDallasite
Posts: 273
Joined: 27 Oct 2016 03:34
Location: München

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby ContriveDallasite » 22 Feb 2019 03:40

muncien wrote:
Matt777 wrote:How much extra is double tracking going to add to the cost of this epic boondoggle?

If they're going to be spending all this extra money to bring a 3rd rail line to DFW Airport, I would like to see a plan to integrate the 3 lines into one central station at DFW, and then buses from each terminal to "DFW Airport Central Rail Station." Users could get info and buy tickets from one station and then enter a numbered platform area like the ones in other parts of the globe.


Isn't that the plan? I mean, unless you call that short walk between DART and Texrail significant enough to make them two stations. Or, are they now talking about stopping Cotton Belt at the DFW 'North' station? Maybe I missed that update...


In before there is a 3rd station with parallel tracks terminating at DFW... Still think it's ridiculous that they couldn't engineer something more pragmatic than the current DART and TexRail solution.

User avatar
tamtagon
Site Admin
Posts: 1703
Joined: 16 Oct 2016 12:04

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby tamtagon » 22 Feb 2019 08:11

I like to think DFW's current train station scheme is an intentionally temporary start up design; passenger trains will transect the airport to Centerport and then Arlington Stadiums/UTA.

User avatar
The_Overdog
Posts: 430
Joined: 21 Oct 2016 14:55

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby The_Overdog » 22 Feb 2019 09:30

How much extra is double tracking going to add to the cost of this epic boondoggle?

$100m, or bringing the total cost back to the $900m cost that's been thrown around from the beginning. I guess without doubletracking, it is $800m.

User avatar
Redblock
Posts: 134
Joined: 24 Nov 2016 11:15

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby Redblock » 22 Feb 2019 10:16

muncien wrote:
Matt777 wrote:How much extra is double tracking going to add to the cost of this epic boondoggle?

If they're going to be spending all this extra money to bring a 3rd rail line to DFW Airport, I would like to see a plan to integrate the 3 lines into one central station at DFW, and then buses from each terminal to "DFW Airport Central Rail Station." Users could get info and buy tickets from one station and then enter a numbered platform area like the ones in other parts of the globe.


Isn't that the plan? I mean, unless you call that short walk between DART and Texrail significant enough to make them two stations. Or, are they now talking about stopping Cotton Belt at the DFW 'North' station? Maybe I missed that update...


The plan has always been for the Cotton Belt Line to use the Terminal B Station along with TEXRail and for the Cotton Belt Line to share the North DFW Station. The bridge over 121/114 is wide enough for two tracks to accommodate the Cotton Belt trains. This will allow for transfers between the lines without going all the way to Terminal B.

When DART was planning the Orange Line they allowed for a diverging route from the current line between Belt Line and DFW stations to allow half the trains to stop at the North DFW Station. They even built two double track junctions into the Orange Line for construction of this second route.

I do not know if this plan is still around, but it would make North DFW Station a 'union station' for the 3 lines.

User avatar
northsouth
Posts: 50
Joined: 26 Oct 2016 18:59

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby northsouth » 22 Feb 2019 22:23

Redblock wrote:When DART was planning the Orange Line they allowed for a diverging route from the current line between Belt Line and DFW stations to allow half the trains to stop at the North DFW Station. They even built two double track junctions into the Orange Line for construction of this second route.

I do not know if this plan is still around, but it would make North DFW Station a 'union station' for the 3 lines.


As per section 2.5.5 of the FEIS (page 108 on https://www.dart.org/ShareRoot/about/ex ... andROD.pdf ), the Orange Line loop has been cancelled primarily due to right of way constraints, i.e. development in the area, and airport-imposed constraints along the TEXRail route into the airport, which was changed to be wide enough to accommodate a Cotton Belt track, negating the asinine setup of having to transfer from the Cotton Belt to TEXRail or the Orange Line to get from DFW North to the airport proper.

The loop was a bad idea to begin with, and I'm glad it is now just a footnote to explain two unused junctions on the Orange Line.

User avatar
jeffbrown2002
Posts: 34
Joined: 03 Nov 2016 01:28

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby jeffbrown2002 » 04 Mar 2019 17:13

So it looks like the Cotton Belt will be getting a color designation after all to better align it with DART's other rail services. Apparently it's going to be called the "Silver Line" complete with special branding and custom logo. Seems like a good compromise between having a completely different naming convention like the TRE and being just another color line, and it fits considering the line appears to be envisioned as something in between commuter rail and rapid transit.

Silver Line 1.png
Silver Line 2.png
Silver Line 3.png
Silver Line 4.png


https://www.dart.org/about/board/boardagendas/communicationitem5_26feb19.pdf
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

itsjrd1964
Posts: 657
Joined: 28 Jul 2018 07:38

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby itsjrd1964 » 04 Mar 2019 18:59

jeffbrown2002 wrote:So it looks like the Cotton Belt will be getting a color designation after all to better align it with DART's other rail services. Apparently it's going to be called the "Silver Line" complete with special branding and custom logo. Seems like a good compromise between having a completely different naming convention like the TRE and being just another color line, and it fits considering the line appears to be envisioned as something in between commuter rail and rapid transit.

Silver Line 1.pngSilver Line 2.pngSilver Line 3.pngSilver Line 4.png

https://www.dart.org/about/board/boardagendas/communicationitem5_26feb19.pdf


I guess a color-labeling is just as good as any. Plus if the cars have any silver and blue on them like the picture, some may think Dallas Cowboys (the line passes near their former Valley Ranch main offices), maybe. As long as the Cotton Belt Railroad was a thing, I never heard of any negative connotations about the name. Either way, I wondered if they would really end up using "Cotton Belt" as part of the line's name.

DPatel304
Posts: 1589
Joined: 19 Oct 2016 18:49
Location: Turtle Creek

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby DPatel304 » 04 Mar 2019 20:00

Sounds good to me. Silver still fits in with the rest of the colored lines, so it's not confusing, but silver also sounds slightly nicer as well, which might help with the general reputation of DART.

I even notice that in the logo the "Silver line" text is big and bold, while "Dallas Area Rapid Transit" is much smaller.

User avatar
Tivo_Kenevil
Posts: 1382
Joined: 20 Oct 2016 12:24

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 04 Mar 2019 20:32

It really should be a color. Naming it anything else just goes against the rest of system.

lakewoodhobo
Posts: 1008
Joined: 20 Oct 2016 13:49
Location: Elmwood, Oak Cliff

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby lakewoodhobo » 07 Mar 2019 12:05

I'm ok with "Silver Line" but I'm not crazy about the logo that makes it look like one word (SILVERLINE).

I also find it very interesting that there was such a strong negative reaction by the black community to the Cotton Belt name since there's historic context. Does the Cotton Bowl Classic get the same strong reaction, or does it get a pass because everyone loves football?

User avatar
art_suckz
Posts: 106
Joined: 19 Oct 2016 10:02
Location: Design District
Contact:

Re: the Cotton Belt line

Postby art_suckz » 08 Mar 2019 13:49

Football is more important than the New Testament.
To the man who only has a hammer, everything he encounters begins to look like a nail.

cowboyeagle05
Posts: 1913
Joined: 21 Oct 2016 08:45
Location: Dallas

Re: Silver Line

Postby cowboyeagle05 » 14 Mar 2019 14:19

Keep in mind the logo for this line will diminish after it opens. While this line isn't the Green, Blue, Orange and/or Red lines, which don't really have logos, the initial promotion of the opening of new lines tends to create this kind of need for brand awareness. They will put up posters, TV ads etc when they promote its opening but I doubt after a year being open it will show up on more than a few brochures at the Airport and suburban visitor centers. Sure this one is separate because unlike the others it's not going Downtown but I doubt the branding will last very long.

User avatar
ArtVandelay
Posts: 195
Joined: 01 Nov 2016 12:44

Re: Silver Line

Postby ArtVandelay » 06 Apr 2019 16:28

cowboyeagle05 wrote:Keep in mind the logo for this line will diminish after it opens. While this line isn't the Green, Blue, Orange and/or Red lines, which don't really have logos, the initial promotion of the opening of new lines tends to create this kind of need for brand awareness. They will put up posters, TV ads etc when they promote its opening but I doubt after a year being open it will show up on more than a few brochures at the Airport and suburban visitor centers. Sure this one is separate because unlike the others it's not going Downtown but I doubt the branding will last very long.


Yep. Even the orange line had its own logo:

Image

User avatar
TNWE
Posts: 182
Joined: 03 May 2017 09:42

Re: Silver Line

Postby TNWE » 09 Apr 2019 10:29

Given that the Silver line will have separate rolling stock, I'd guess the branding will "stick" a little more because it is a standalone line. If future developments result in DART running additional DMU-based commuter service (like Frisco or Madill) there may be a rebrand, but for the time being I'd get used to the Silver Line logo and branding.

User avatar
The_Overdog
Posts: 430
Joined: 21 Oct 2016 14:55

Re: Silver Line

Postby The_Overdog » 09 Apr 2019 10:51

They should have saved the SilverLine designation for a train that ran up US75 to that casino just across the Oklahoma border.

User avatar
electricron
Posts: 247
Joined: 29 Oct 2016 11:07

Re: Silver Line

Postby electricron » 13 Apr 2019 00:17

The_Overdog wrote:They should have saved the SilverLine designation for a train that ran up US75 to that casino just across the Oklahoma border.

While DART owns the railroad corridor paralleling US75 as far north as Sherman, why do you think DART will ever build light rail line up that far? Not one city north of Plano contributes any tax revenues to DART. And if they did, the amount of tax revenues from them certainly would not pay for any passenger rail expansion.

User avatar
The_Overdog
Posts: 430
Joined: 21 Oct 2016 14:55

Re: Silver Line

Postby The_Overdog » 14 Apr 2019 03:12

Image

It's a joke son.

User avatar
Redblock
Posts: 134
Joined: 24 Nov 2016 11:15

Re: Silver Line

Postby Redblock » 03 Jun 2019 09:27

DART has ordered 8 FLIRT DMUs from Stadler.

https://www.dart.org/news/news.asp?ID=1402
Last edited by Redblock on 05 Jun 2019 09:42, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
homeworld1031tx
Posts: 97
Joined: 23 Oct 2016 12:23

Re: Silver Line

Postby homeworld1031tx » 03 Jun 2019 11:07

All this time I've been against these commuter rail options since they frankly represent a waste of resources to me, but it's interesting to think how automated mobility might make these very attractive in the next twenty years. If driverless taxis are cheap enough, a user could easily hop on one from their suburban single family home, take it to the train station, catch the train, and then take another quick taxi from an end point station to their office, all in a time frame that might match or beat the highway commute.

Interested to see how this might play out. Highways will only become more congested in even the medium term (before either dedicate lanes or platooning via vehicle to vehicle or v to infrastructure comms for autonomous cars become standard & common place) so these heavy rail lanes offer attractive 'highways' between parts of the city, if the users can easily board last mile options at the end points.

User avatar
electricron
Posts: 247
Joined: 29 Oct 2016 11:07

Re: Silver Line

Postby electricron » 05 Jun 2019 02:13

Redblock wrote:DART has ordered 8 FLIRT Emus from Stadler.
https://www.dart.org/news/news.asp?ID=1402


They will be DMUs, not EMUs.

User avatar
Redblock
Posts: 134
Joined: 24 Nov 2016 11:15

Re: Silver Line

Postby Redblock » 05 Jun 2019 09:41

electricron wrote:
Redblock wrote:DART has ordered 8 FLIRT Emus from Stadler.
https://www.dart.org/news/news.asp?ID=1402


They will be DMUs, not EMUs.


Of course you are right and I knew that. I don't know if that was my bad typing or auto-cottect.

itsjrd1964
Posts: 657
Joined: 28 Jul 2018 07:38

Re: Silver Line

Postby itsjrd1964 » 06 Jun 2019 12:41

Redblock wrote:
electricron wrote:
Redblock wrote:DART has ordered 8 FLIRT Emus from Stadler.
https://www.dart.org/news/news.asp?ID=1402


They will be DMUs, not EMUs.


Of course you are right and I knew that. I don't know if that was my bad typing or auto-cottect.


That auto-cottect, it's a killer....

User avatar
electricron
Posts: 247
Joined: 29 Oct 2016 11:07

Re: Silver Line

Postby electricron » 07 Jun 2019 08:26

itsjrd1964 wrote:That auto-cottect, it's a killer....

Whether it is auto-correct or auto-cottect, it also slays me too.

User avatar
tamtagon
Site Admin
Posts: 1703
Joined: 16 Oct 2016 12:04

Re: Silver Line

Postby tamtagon » 07 Jun 2019 12:05

^hahahaha

User avatar
Alex Rodriguez
Posts: 100
Joined: 23 Oct 2016 14:31

Re: Silver Line

Postby Alex Rodriguez » 24 Jun 2019 09:24

https://www.dart.org/news/news.asp?ID=1405

"At DFW Airport, the project will connect to the TEXRail Regional Rail Line to Fort Worth and provide access to the DFW Airport Skylink. The Silver Line will interface with three DART light rail lines: The Red/Orange Lines in Richardson/Plano, the Green Line in Carrollton and the Orange Line at DFW Airport."

Couple of questions: 1) Is the Orange Line Phase 2 to DFW North station still a thing or did it get permanently cancelled. I know they built the stub out for it, but wasnt' sure if it was still in the plans. 2) What is the interface look like between Terminal A station and Terminal B station? Is there a DART shuttle that goes back and forth between the two and what is the frequency?

Thanks.

User avatar
Tucy
Posts: 561
Joined: 19 Oct 2016 12:50

Re: Silver Line

Postby Tucy » 24 Jun 2019 12:21

Alex Rodriguez wrote:https://www.dart.org/news/news.asp?ID=1405

"At DFW Airport, the project will connect to the TEXRail Regional Rail Line to Fort Worth and provide access to the DFW Airport Skylink. The Silver Line will interface with three DART light rail lines: The Red/Orange Lines in Richardson/Plano, the Green Line in Carrollton and the Orange Line at DFW Airport."

Couple of questions: 1) Is the Orange Line Phase 2 to DFW North station still a thing or did it get permanently cancelled. I know they built the stub out for it, but wasnt' sure if it was still in the plans. 2) What is the interface look like between Terminal A station and Terminal B station? Is there a DART shuttle that goes back and forth between the two and what is the frequency?

Thanks.


I believe the "interface" looks a lot like a sidewalk.

User avatar
northsouth
Posts: 50
Joined: 26 Oct 2016 18:59

Re: Silver Line

Postby northsouth » 24 Jun 2019 22:38

Alex Rodriguez wrote: 1) Is the Orange Line Phase 2 to DFW North station still a thing or did it get permanently cancelled. I know they built the stub out for it, but wasnt' sure if it was still in the plans.


Buried in the FEIS for the Silver Line they mentioned that it's cancelled. I went into further detail with a link to the section of the FEIS higher up on this page. The ramp stubs on either end will forever be monuments to that plan, though I imagine at some point down the road when they're doing track replacement on that part of the line, they'll take out the switches to lessen wear on the wheels, leaving just the ramp stub in the embankment.

itsjrd1964
Posts: 657
Joined: 28 Jul 2018 07:38

Re: Silver Line

Postby itsjrd1964 » 25 Jun 2019 04:00

Tucy wrote:
Alex Rodriguez wrote:https://www.dart.org/news/news.asp?ID=1405

"At DFW Airport, the project will connect to the TEXRail Regional Rail Line to Fort Worth and provide access to the DFW Airport Skylink. The Silver Line will interface with three DART light rail lines: The Red/Orange Lines in Richardson/Plano, the Green Line in Carrollton and the Orange Line at DFW Airport."

Couple of questions: 1) Is the Orange Line Phase 2 to DFW North station still a thing or did it get permanently cancelled. I know they built the stub out for it, but wasnt' sure if it was still in the plans. 2) What is the interface look like between Terminal A station and Terminal B station? Is there a DART shuttle that goes back and forth between the two and what is the frequency?

Thanks.


I believe the "interface" looks a lot like a sidewalk.


There is a sidewalk between the 2. There is the "Terminal Link" airport shuttle between terminals, but the walk between the DART station and the TexRail station is infinitely quicker. Mind you, at my last look a few weeks ago, the signage is *somewhat* better, but it could still use more improvement (I've meant to post pics from then, but sorry, haven't gotten to it yet).

As far as further phases involving the Orange line, the only things DART has mentioned more recently have been involving future/postponed station additions, including Carpenter Ranch (between North Lake College station and Irving Convention Center station, alongside the development that Pioneer Natural Resources is moving to) and Loop 12 station (alongside the former Texas Stadium acreage, I guess whenever that develops)... no extensions or changes that I've heard of otherwise.

User avatar
Redblock
Posts: 134
Joined: 24 Nov 2016 11:15

Re: Silver Line

Postby Redblock » 25 Jun 2019 09:21

On the Orange Line, the Carpenter Ranch Station is now called Hidden Ridge Station.

https://www.dart.org/news/news.asp?ID=1389

itsjrd1964
Posts: 657
Joined: 28 Jul 2018 07:38

Re: Silver Line

Postby itsjrd1964 » 28 Jun 2019 02:01

Redblock wrote:On the Orange Line, the Carpenter Ranch Station is now called Hidden Ridge Station.

https://www.dart.org/news/news.asp?ID=1389


Missed that, but "Hidden Ridge" does sound more current and logical, even though a name like "Carpenter Ranch" gives the nod to local history and early years of Las Colinas itself.

User avatar
TNWE
Posts: 182
Joined: 03 May 2017 09:42

Re: Silver Line

Postby TNWE » 02 Jul 2019 14:59

Tucy wrote:
Alex Rodriguez wrote:https://www.dart.org/news/news.asp?ID=1405

"At DFW Airport, the project will connect to the TEXRail Regional Rail Line to Fort Worth and provide access to the DFW Airport Skylink. The Silver Line will interface with three DART light rail lines: The Red/Orange Lines in Richardson/Plano, the Green Line in Carrollton and the Orange Line at DFW Airport."

Couple of questions: 1) Is the Orange Line Phase 2 to DFW North station still a thing or did it get permanently cancelled. I know they built the stub out for it, but wasnt' sure if it was still in the plans. 2) What is the interface look like between Terminal A station and Terminal B station? Is there a DART shuttle that goes back and forth between the two and what is the frequency?

Thanks.


I believe the "interface" looks a lot like a sidewalk.

And takes all of about 5 minutes to traverse. There are also awnings and space for bus stops, although nothing stops there now except for service interruption buses. It would be nice if they could have stops for direct shuttles to Terminals C, D, and E, rather than relying on the current Terminal Link system, but there's just not the demand right now.

User avatar
northsouth
Posts: 50
Joined: 26 Oct 2016 18:59

Re: Silver Line

Postby northsouth » 23 Jul 2019 19:01

https://www.dart.org/ShareRoot/about/expansion/cottonbelt/DARTCottonBeltMeeting22jul19.pdf

Looks like they've scaled down the station designs to something more reasonable than the ones described in the EIS.

User avatar
bachmanlad
Posts: 7
Joined: 03 Aug 2019 23:30
Location: NW Dallas

Re: Silver Line

Postby bachmanlad » 04 Aug 2019 03:12

TNWE wrote:And takes all of about 5 minutes to traverse. There are also awnings and space for bus stops, although nothing stops there now except for service interruption buses. It would be nice if they could have stops for direct shuttles to Terminals C, D, and E, rather than relying on the current Terminal Link system, but there's just not the demand right now.


It's quite a pleasant walk as long as it's not boiling or freezing out. The sidewalks are covered and nicely landscaped.

In the oldest concept art, the two platforms are even with one another (instead of Terminal B Station being a little farther south) and the walkway cuts cleanly through the middle instead of doing the awkward U-shaped loop around the north ends of the platforms it does now. I think they ended up doing it the way they did because of the bus stop there. There would have to have been walkways to the bus stop anyway, and cutting a trench for another, more direct, walkway in the middle of the platforms would have been an extra expense.

Rebranding them as a single station would simplify system maps and I am all for it, but it would be a little misleading for transfers because of the walk time from tracks 1-2 to tracks 3-4. Then again, that wouldn't be an issue as long as DART and T-Metro coordinated their schedules to account for it, which they should be doing anyway.

I never bother with the Terminal Link buses at all if I can avoid them. I just go through security right at Terminal A, then take Skylink to wherever my gate is - it's faster, more reliable, and more frequent than the buses.

northsouth wrote:https://www.dart.org/ShareRoot/about/expansion/cottonbelt/DARTCottonBeltMeeting22jul19.pdf

Looks like they've scaled down the station designs to something more reasonable than the ones described in the EIS.


I like it. It doesn't look quite as nice as the cottony designs in the EIS did, but the "DART rail station, but sleek and silvery" look is a great fit for the new brand. More importantly, it'll do a much better job of keeping the sun/rain/sleet off.
Last edited by bachmanlad on 06 Aug 2019 00:27, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Jbarn
Posts: 98
Joined: 05 Nov 2016 18:58

Re: Silver Line

Postby Jbarn » 04 Aug 2019 20:31

bachmanlad wrote:
TNWE wrote:And takes all of about 5 minutes to traverse. There are also awnings and space for bus stops, although nothing stops there now except for service interruption buses. It would be nice if they could have stops for direct shuttles to Terminals C, D, and E, rather than relying on the current Terminal Link system, but there's just not the demand right now.


It's quite a pleasant walk as long as it's not boiling or freezing out. The sidewalks are covered and nicely landscaped.

In the oldest concept art, the two platforms are even with one another (instead of Terminal B Station being a little farther south) and the walkway cuts cleanly through the middle instead of doing the awkward U-shaped loop around the north ends of the platforms it does now. I think they ended up doing it the way they did because of the bus stop there. There would have to have been walkways to the bus stop anyway, and cutting a trench for another, more direct, walkway in the middle of the platforms would have been an extra expense.

Rebranding them as a single station would simplify system maps and I am all for it, but it would be a little misleading for transfers because of the walk time from tracks 1-2 to tracks 2-4. Then again, that wouldn't be an issue as long as DART and T-Metro coordinated their schedules to account for it, which they should be doing anyway.

I never bother with the Terminal Link buses at all if I can avoid them. I just go through security right at Terminal A, then take Skylink to wherever my gate is - it's faster, more reliable, and more frequent than the buses.

northsouth wrote:https://www.dart.org/ShareRoot/about/expansion/cottonbelt/DARTCottonBeltMeeting22jul19.pdf

Looks like they've scaled down the station designs to something more reasonable than the ones described in the EIS.


I like it. It doesn't look quite as nice as the cottony designs in the EIS did, but the "DART rail station, but sleek and silvery" look is a great fit for the new brand. More importantly, it'll do a much better job of keeping the sun/rain/sleet off.



Regarding Terminal Link; the problem is if you check luggage and arrive back at any terminal other than Terminal A, you pretty much have to take Terminal Link. When I got back from a trip a few weeks ago, it took terminal link 45 minutes to come pick us up and then a 20 minute ride to get us to Terminal A. Added an hour to our trip. This is probably one of the reasons very few people are taking the orange line to DFW. That and the fact that the majority of the people on the trains to and fro DFW are homeless and are using them as sleeper trains. It can be intimidating.

DPatel304
Posts: 1589
Joined: 19 Oct 2016 18:49
Location: Turtle Creek

Re: Silver Line

Postby DPatel304 » 19 Sep 2019 14:00

DART breaks ground on Silver Line along the old Cotton Belt corridor
The plan is to have the Silver Line operating in three years.

https://www.fox4news.com/news/dart-brea ... t-corridor

I had no idea we were so close to ground breaking on this project. Truthfully I had kinda shut out most information regarding this as I'm not fully in support of it, and I figured it was still going to be a ways off.

User avatar
Matt777
Posts: 668
Joined: 28 Oct 2016 09:10

Re: Silver Line

Postby Matt777 » 19 Sep 2019 14:39

DPatel304 wrote:
DART breaks ground on Silver Line along the old Cotton Belt corridor
The plan is to have the Silver Line operating in three years.

https://www.fox4news.com/news/dart-brea ... t-corridor

I had no idea we were so close to ground breaking on this project. Truthfully I had kinda shut out most information regarding this as I'm not fully in support of it, and I figured it was still going to be a ways off.


Yikes. They want to get this boondoggle operational quickly. Can't wait for the 20/20 feature story on "The Train to Nowhere."

User avatar
Tivo_Kenevil
Posts: 1382
Joined: 20 Oct 2016 12:24

Re: Silver Line

Postby Tivo_Kenevil » 19 Sep 2019 15:32

Dart is more of bullet point than actually useful. We've got the longest train system in America..that's all I hear.

We can only hope the region densifies to the point where it becomes useful.


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests

Login