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DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 21 Oct 2016 10:53
by art_suckz
http://www.kcentv.com/news/local/texas- ... /339230419

Texas University students compete to design bullet train stations
Jim Hice, KCEN 5:40 PM. CDT October 20, 2016

The students were asked to provide their design proposals by October 31st. They must include:

-A vision statement
-Station concepts, with considerations for programming, urban connectivity, use of local materials, environmental sustainability and customer focus.
·Maximum of three presentations 24” x 36” posters expressing the students’ vision.
·Five to 10 conceptual design drawings.

The Texas Central Student Design Competition Committee and its judges will evaluate the students’ entries, based on their creativity in vision, technical accuracy, quality of submittal materials and overall presentation.

This is the list of universities included in the competition:

· Texas A&M
· Prairie View A&M
· University of Texas at San Antonio
· University of Texas at Arlington
· University of Texas
· Texas Tech University
· University of Houston
· Rice University

All competition documents are available online.


http://www.texascentral.com/station-competition/

How would you like to have a chance to design the next St. Pancras Station in London or Grand Central Terminal in New York?


Was really hoping for some details about size and amenities.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 21 Oct 2016 13:35
by DPatel304
Has there been any progress on the HSR since the forum went down? This site has been my only source of news for all things Dallas, so I'm not sure if and how the HSR has progressed lately.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 21 Oct 2016 14:14
by art_suckz
The only thing I can think of off the top of my head is that TCR withdrew a case from a Houston court trying to gain access for surveyors on an owners land. I assume they have a better strategy in mind.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 22 Oct 2016 06:38
by tamtagon
I'm not sure what the city/DART/NCTCOG has planned for the LRT 'spur' to extend from Union Station to the HSR station.... there needs to be the all-access interface....

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 28 Oct 2016 12:02
by art_suckz
A staggering 76 percent of those polled support a privately built train connecting the state’s two largest metro areas. Only 10 percent of those polled oppose the high-speed rail.

http://www.wfaa.com/news/local/texas-ne ... /343413416

Landon Haaf, WFAA 5:55 AM. CDT October 28, 2016

The poll also showed wide support for a bullet train from Dallas to Houston, if no tax dollars are used. A staggering 76 percent of those polled support a privately built train connecting the state’s two largest metro areas. Only 10 percent of those polled oppose the high-speed rail.

The bullet train has been met with opposition from residents in rural counties along the planned route. Efforts from representatives of those counties to block the measure have failed.


edit: The link mentions the rail poll at the bottom.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 28 Oct 2016 12:37
by dukemeredith
^^ Wrong link.

Has there been any mention of employing eminent domain to acquire the property needed for the tracks?


Edit: here's a recent article answering my question above:

http://www.star-telegram.com/news/traff ... 16272.html

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 28 Oct 2016 15:38
by art_suckz
The link mentions the rail poll at the bottom.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 30 Oct 2016 14:39
by AMD86
It would be amazing if these stations would look like St. Pancras Station in London or Grand Central Terminal in New York but given Dallas' penchant for producing some of the ugliest architecture I have ever seen in a city I won't hold my breath.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 31 Oct 2016 02:54
by willyk
14 Beautiful Train Stations From Around the World

http://m.mentalfloss.com/article.php?id=54737

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 07 Nov 2016 13:21
by art_suckz
Transportation Symposium at College Station.

Facebook Video of the Meeting: HSR talk starts at 2:00.
https://www.facebook.com/texastribune/v ... 277570837/



http://www.theeagle.com/news/local/side ... a1785.html

Dave McDermand/The Eagle

A debate over whether the proposed privately developed bullet train between Houston and Dallas -- with a stop in Grimes County -- will ever become a reality took center stage Thursday at a transportation symposium on the Texas A&M campus.

...

The issue was a natural fit for the one-day event hosted by The Texas Tribune and Texas A&M Transportation Institute as elected officials, the Texas Department of Transportation, homeowners against the project, supporters and students gathered to hear about the high-speed rail estimated to cost roughly $10 billion.

The event looked at the most serious challenges facing transportation in Texas as infrastructure continues to age and the population continues its rapid growth.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 15 Nov 2016 16:31
by Tnexster
Plano city council signals support for high-speed rail between Dallas and Houston

http://www.dallasnews.com/news/plano/20 ... as-houston

The council voted 7-1 Monday night to adopt a resolution supporting the project, with Council member Tom Harrison the lone dissenter. City spokesman, Steve Stoler, said the council supported the resolution because it believes the project will help alleviate traffic in certain areas, like along Interstate 45, and boost the regional economy.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 16 Nov 2016 10:09
by exelone31
I feel like I'm missing something here. Is Plano's approval simply supposed to act as a signal to other, more directly related, cities to support it as well? This feels like Carrollton taking a vote on whether they support bike lanes in Fort Worth.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 16 Nov 2016 10:39
by art_suckz
Maybe because the argument has been that only Houston and Dallas will benefit from this. I think some of the opposing counties are pretty close to Houston correct? This could reframe it as a more regional benefit?

Im just reaching here.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 16 Nov 2016 16:16
by Tnexster
IDK, from the article it sounds like Texas Central is reaching out to local cities for support. Maybe it's just a political move to show they have broad support systemwide.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 16 Nov 2016 22:16
by electricron
We just had an election. Come January the Legislature will convene. Politically activities, both for and against Texas Central, will be at an all time high. With so much opposition from the corridor route, why be surprised the cities that might be riding these trains express on the record their support?
Plano is just one Red Line light rail line ride from the projected Texas Central train station in downtown Dallas. Citizens of Plano will be able with a transfer to ride trains all the way to Houston. So yes, Plano is positively impacted by the HSR line.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 17 Nov 2016 04:23
by willyk
Plano will have representatives in the Texas House and Senate. This signals them to support the project come January.

It is hard to imagine the Plano delegation throwing in with Grimes County. But maybe TCR wants to get enough of these supporting resolutions that indirectly they can say have the support of a majority of the two houses, or a majority of the population. I recall that Waco passed a similar resolution.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 17 Nov 2016 12:02
by exelone31
That makes sense. The more nays you get, even if not directly involved, can perhaps sway the nays.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 17 Nov 2016 14:00
by The_Overdog
It is hard to imagine the Plano delegation throwing in with Grimes County.

Well there was one Plano city councilman who threw in with Grimes County, so it's not that hard to imagine. What could that guy even have to gain from being contrary? I'd bet many cities will be a closer vote than 7-1.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 17 Nov 2016 15:06
by dukemeredith
The_Overdog wrote:
It is hard to imagine the Plano delegation throwing in with Grimes County.

Well there was one Plano city councilman who threw in with Grimes County, so it's not that hard to imagine. What could that guy even have to gain from being contrary? I'd bet many cities will be a closer vote than 7-1.



He's probably holding out to have the HSR station in Plano!

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 02 Dec 2016 13:27
by dollaztx
Design Competition winners were announced on the 30th. You can see the full details of the winners here:
http://www.texascentral.com/station-competition/

Really love the Urban Design. The Evacuation Platform shown on the Brazos Valley Station is also a good idea for hurricanes.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 02 Dec 2016 21:14
by Tnexster
I also really do like that urban design. I would love to see something like that here, hope they pursue something like that, makes a statement.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 06 Dec 2016 10:39
by gshelton91
now that DMN is moving to the Statler i would love to see them redevelop the DMN Site as the downtown train station. It would be simple to then connect it to the DART Rail lines. But, I see a lot of real estate up side for a station in the Cedars.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 06 Dec 2016 12:03
by electricron
gshelton91 wrote:now that DMN is moving to the Statler i would love to see them redevelop the DMN Site as the downtown train station. It would be simple to then connect it to the DART Rail lines. But, I see a lot of real estate up side for a station in the Cedars.

How many times do I to point out that the DMN building is on the wrong side of the Convention Center? :x
The HSR trains Texas Central plans to use can't share tracks with freight trains or with light rail trains. How do you expect the HSR tracks to plow through the Convention Center to get to the DMN site? :?:
That's why Texas Central plans to place their station site south of the Convention Center! 8-)

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 06 Dec 2016 12:28
by muncien
electricron wrote:
gshelton91 wrote:now that DMN is moving to the Statler i would love to see them redevelop the DMN Site as the downtown train station. It would be simple to then connect it to the DART Rail lines. But, I see a lot of real estate up side for a station in the Cedars.

How many times do I to point out that the DMN building is on the wrong side of the Convention Center? :x
The HSR trains Texas Central plans to use can't share tracks with freight trains or with light rail trains. How do you expect the HSR tracks to plow through the Convention Center to get to the DMN site? :?:
That's why Texas Central plans to place their station site south of the Convention Center! 8-)


Well, technically, the existing Hotel street is already one grade below those tracks and currently dips under that corner of the CC with plenty of clearance, while also going over I30. But a tunnel underneath those tracks to get you to the DMN property, while possible, won't be easy. It would certainly put the station in a prime location, but it would also limit your ability to continue on towards the north or west in the future.

I really don't see that the HSR tracks need to be immediately adjacent to the DART stations, so long as whatever is in between is built out to be inviting. Most people walk much further inside an airport terminal. It's just a matter of making it a destination. It would also help if the current proposal were to scoot it right up to the CC instead of being completely south of I30. I thought the idea of spanning the freeway with the station was pretty cool... yet costly no doubt.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 06 Dec 2016 17:03
by electricron
The bridge over I-30 is already wide enough to hold the HSR tracks and platforms, along with the existing city street. I just don't know if it is strong enough to handle the additional weight.

While I would prefer seeing the HSR train station as close as possible to the Convention Center, as easier and shorter access to a light rail station, I'm not so sure I would like to see the station placed over I-30. Can you see the horror of a fuel tank truck on fire under the train station? The risk of any bridge is probably okay because it will not always be occupied, unlike a train station.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 06 Dec 2016 22:46
by willyk
electricron wrote:
gshelton91 wrote:now that DMN is moving to the Statler i would love to see them redevelop the DMN Site as the downtown train station. It would be simple to then connect it to the DART Rail lines. But, I see a lot of real estate up side for a station in the Cedars.

How many times do I to point out that the DMN building is on the wrong side of the Convention Center? :x
The HSR trains Texas Central plans to use can't share tracks with freight trains or with light rail trains. How do you expect the HSR tracks to plow through the Convention Center to get to the DMN site? :?:
That's why Texas Central plans to place their station site south of the Convention Center! 8-)


1. How do we know that the DMN won't make a competing offer to put the HSR station on their site?

2. And even if they don't, it seems quite doable to connect their site to an HSR station on the south side of the DCC with something like the DFW Tram.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 07 Dec 2016 09:59
by gshelton91
electricron wrote:
gshelton91 wrote:now that DMN is moving to the Statler i would love to see them redevelop the DMN Site as the downtown train station. It would be simple to then connect it to the DART Rail lines. But, I see a lot of real estate up side for a station in the Cedars.

How many times do I to point out that the DMN building is on the wrong side of the Convention Center? :x
The HSR trains Texas Central plans to use can't share tracks with freight trains or with light rail trains. How do you expect the HSR tracks to plow through the Convention Center to get to the DMN site? :?:
That's why Texas Central plans to place their station site south of the Convention Center! 8-)



I did not state it but my assumption was not that they would use the existing track infrastructure to access the DMN site I never even considered that a possibility for multiple reason even beyond the ones you stated - even i know that Bullet trains run on special tracks. My original assumption was that they would tunnel tracks in and create subterranean platforms. But I was recently reading something about the planned stations and they stated that the trains would be elevated and come into the station 6 stories above ground. Either way it seems to me that they would be able to use that site and with its proximity to the already existing parking garage, DART and Major hotels it seems like a great site. I would say the big downside is that the land south of I30 they have mostly been talking about is cheaper and much more developable land near by that might help them recover some of the cost of building the station -- assuming it becomes a great success.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 07 Dec 2016 10:10
by gshelton91
muncien wrote:
electricron wrote:
gshelton91 wrote:now that DMN is moving to the Statler i would love to see them redevelop the DMN Site as the downtown train station. It would be simple to then connect it to the DART Rail lines. But, I see a lot of real estate up side for a station in the Cedars.

How many times do I to point out that the DMN building is on the wrong side of the Convention Center? :x
The HSR trains Texas Central plans to use can't share tracks with freight trains or with light rail trains. How do you expect the HSR tracks to plow through the Convention Center to get to the DMN site? :?:
That's why Texas Central plans to place their station site south of the Convention Center! 8-)


Well, technically, the existing Hotel street is already one grade below those tracks and currently dips under that corner of the CC with plenty of clearance, while also going over I30. But a tunnel underneath those tracks to get you to the DMN property, while possible, won't be easy. It would certainly put the station in a prime location, but it would also limit your ability to continue on towards the north or west in the future.

I really don't see that the HSR tracks need to be immediately adjacent to the DART stations, so long as whatever is in between is built out to be inviting. Most people walk much further inside an airport terminal. It's just a matter of making it a destination. It would also help if the current proposal were to scoot it right up to the CC instead of being completely south of I30. I thought the idea of spanning the freeway with the station was pretty cool... yet costly no doubt.


I kind of agree with what you are saying here... it's fairly easy to just pick up an uber and go directly to your destination now... But i can tell you when i was in Japan recently having an easy connection between the bullet train and the subway made live much easier and when it was a difficult walk with luggage in a crowded tunnel to connect to the train you needed it was a huge pain.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 07 Dec 2016 10:57
by tamtagon
I've always had the assumption that regardless of HSR location, DART would build an adjacent light rail access point.... NCTCOG has money to help with that, too, so if HSR happens, I think it's pretty safe to assume all DART light rail routes will be within a five minute climate controlled walk.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 07 Dec 2016 12:01
by DPatel304
gshelton91 wrote:I kind of agree with what you are saying here... it's fairly easy to just pick up an uber and go directly to your destination now... But i can tell you when i was in Japan recently having an easy connection between the bullet train and the subway made live much easier and when it was a difficult walk with luggage in a crowded tunnel to connect to the train you needed it was a huge pain.


I totally agree with you. It seems like such a small distance, but having a seamless connection makes a world of difference.

Last time I was in London, I remember one instance, in particular, where I was traveling from London to Manchester, I had to exit the station, walk about five minutes to get to the next train station that would take me out of the city. I suppose it was the equivalent of using the DART to get close to the HSR, and then having to walk the rest of the way. I'm not sure if you always have to walk to that particular HSR station in London, or if it just happened to be the route I took, but that particular trip stuck out in my mind as being a bit of a hassle. It's kinda stupid to think that me, coming from Dallas, had a problem with the public transportation in London, but that one particular leg would have been better if I didn't have to exit the station to transfer.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 15 Dec 2016 20:58
by xen0blue
tamtagon wrote:I've always had the assumption that regardless of HSR location, DART would build an adjacent light rail access point.... NCTCOG has money to help with that, too, so if HSR happens, I think it's pretty safe to assume all DART light rail routes will be within a five minute climate controlled walk.


If they don't put the HSR in Union Station, it will be a travesty. Until (and if) D2 comes to Union Station, Union Station will maintain relative irrelevance. Such a grand building needs to be matched by a grand purpose.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 16 Dec 2016 00:36
by Tnexster
Do they have room to add the HSR station at Union? There is a lot going on right there, I had the impression there was a reason they are placing the station in another spot.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 16 Dec 2016 18:44
by electricron
Tnexster wrote:Do they have room to add the HSR station at Union? There is a lot going on right there, I had the impression there was a reason they are placing the station in another spot.

No, they don't have room at Union Station for HSR platforms and tracks.

They will also have many difficulties building HSR tracks through the Dallas K.B. Hutchison Convention Center to reach either the DMN building or Union Station. That's why the FRA and Central Texas have proposed placing the new HSR train station near I-30, before reaching the Convention Center.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 16 Dec 2016 19:19
by tamtagon
^even if the station is situated over I-30, most of the substantial station mixed use development will be South Side.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 20 Dec 2016 13:12
by cowboyeagle05
Lets put it this way Texas Central is building its plans around what works in Japan which is that the HSR and other connecting transit systems are the keys to success along with developing the surrounding property. You know Texas Central is keeping DART leaders in their detailed discussions because they need the buses, trains, and streetcars to be feeding the machine in addition to parking cars and creating spaces for Lyft/Uber/Taxi drop-offs. This won't be something that Texas Cental just builds and lets DART decide when and how to connect. Texas Central will be making sure it's a solid connection between the two.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 20 Dec 2016 21:43
by electricron
Texas Central is not going to pay all of DART's expenses to serve their new HSR train station. They are going to expect DART to pay for their own services, just like about every other business in Dallas.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 21 Dec 2016 09:50
by cowboyeagle05
electricron wrote:Texas Central is not going to pay all of DART's expenses to serve their new HSR train station. They are going to expect DART to pay for their own services, just like about every other business in Dallas.


I never said HSR would pay DART's expenses I was merely stating the obvious reality is that Texas Central wants a firm handshake not a wave from DART services. Texas Central is going to make sure their station connection works for DART in many ways. I never suggested Texas Central would pay for DART connections. DART is just as excited about a solid connection between the two services so their collaboration is paramount to both parties success.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 27 Dec 2016 11:59
by Haretip
I'm headed to Tokyo in February and plan to include a trip on the Tokaido Shinkansen line. A little preview of the equipment and technology proposed for the Dallas to Houston high speed rail.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 24 Jan 2017 18:05
by electricron
The Texas Central HSR project on possible short list of Trump infrastrucure projects....
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/politic ... 164.html#0

P.S. So is DART's Cotton Belt Line.

It'll be interesting to see what projects make the final list.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 24 Jan 2017 18:21
by DPatel304
I was under the impression that this was going to be a privately funded project, is that not the case?

Either way, I'm happy that this project has such a priority. Good news for Cotton Belt too, but, to be honest, I'd much rather see the HSR and D2 come to fruition first, although I realize it's also possible that all three projects get going around the same time too.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 24 Jan 2017 19:57
by electricron
DPatel304 wrote:I was under the impression that this was going to be a privately funded project, is that not the case?

Either way, I'm happy that this project has such a priority. Good news for Cotton Belt too, but, to be honest, I'd much rather see the HSR and D2 come to fruition first, although I realize it's also possible that all three projects get going around the same time too.


Whether D2 or the Cotton Belt or receives federal matching funding, that should leave DART sufficient funds to build both fairly soon. The best scenario would be both receive federal matching funding.

Whereas Texas Central wants to be independent and privately funded, I'm not so sure they would decline federal funding. Of course, federal funding will probably eliminate Japanese built N700 train sets, and I'm not sure the Japanese will wish to build them in the USA. :roll:
And I don't think Trump will want to help finance building them in Japan.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 25 Jan 2017 09:40
by cowboyeagle05
This does seem to put the project in interesting odds. The project is lead by a group hell bent on using Japanese technology and to be run privately. Trump though may want to dangle a carrot of public funding to make the project less Japanese friendly. Will he be able to stop it if they refuse to get on board the ALL American Made train.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 25 Jan 2017 10:32
by tamtagon
Funny thing about politics... The pending support from President Trump for the high speed train between Dallas and Houston, may confound and conflict the Grimes County Protesters!

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 26 Jan 2017 05:28
by rantanamo
Precisely my thoughts in the last two posts. Does Trump really want to get involved with this? Does TCR really want to get involved with this? There are political implications for both. If this can succeed privately it would be best for all parties.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 26 Jan 2017 13:22
by art_suckz
I don't see how this can happen at all if they switch the trains. The track system is integrated with the trains.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 26 Jan 2017 13:36
by DPatel304
Is it possible that the plan is to still have this project be privately funded and Trump is simply just trying to take credit for it if/when it does happen?

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 26 Jan 2017 16:55
by rantanamo
DPatel304 wrote:Is it possible that the plan is to still have this project be privately funded and Trump is simply just trying to take credit for it if/when it does happen?


yes. If they take public funds, doesn't that make eminent domain easier? Wouldn't this be some of his supporters feeling screwed over by this. I think leaving this private is best for all parties.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 27 Jan 2017 10:53
by electricron
All Texas Central would need from Trump is low interest loan guarantees, recognition from the federal government with the least financial commitment, recognition Texas Central could then use in court to establish they are a real railroad so they can start eminent domain proceedings.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 27 Jan 2017 11:09
by tamtagon
I'd like to see the DFW-Austin-San Antonio leg get a jump start.

Re: DALLAS to HOUSTON High Speed Rail

Posted: 27 Jan 2017 11:45
by Tnexster
^Me too, I wonder how long it will be until that happens. I guess they would need to be up and running, prove it makes money and then start? Or are they so confident in their model that they could at least start planning. That I-35 corridor needs help.