MATA: M-Line Trolley

[muncien]

With all that development going on up that way, there has to be a big increase in funds coming in... assuming assessors are doing their job right (which isn't always the case).

[tanzoak]

Right now they're using the money to support the Knox Complete Streets project. The MATA extension would be the next logical project (assuming they re-up the district this year). The PID gets $300k a year for a quite small area.

http://www.dallasecodev.org/429/Knox-Street-PID

[joshua.dodd]

I believe the funds are coming from federal grants. Since the MATA has taken federal grant money, there have been a lot of changes in the business now that it is under federal mandates. But, as I am aware, the Knox Henderson is going to happen.

[tanzoak]

Mm as far as I know, there hasn't been any money put towards an extension yet, I don't think? There was a request to NCTCOG earlier this year for $1mil for a study, but I don't know what the status of that is.

[electricron]

Right now they're using the money to support the Knox Complete Streets project. The MATA extension would be the next logical project (assuming they re-up the district this year). The PID gets $300k a year for a quite small area.

A fair estimate of costs based on twice the MATA extension in downtown Dallas because a Kox extension would be twice as far, would be around $20 million,
Sources of data
https://dartdallas.dart.org/2015/05/04/ ... wn-access/
http://www.apta.com/resources/hottopics ... -Sheet.pdf
Yes, both web sites report nearly $10 million for just 0.65 (2/3rds) mile extension.
An extension loop to Knox up McKinney and down Cole will be at least 1.3 miles in length.
FYI
http://dallascityhall.com/government/ci ... tation.pdf

DART and NCTCOG provided the local match for the FTA funding. Do you think DART would provide more when they'll be asked to fund the Knox-Henderson subway station for this MATA expansion to meet?

[cowboyeagle05]

Mm as far as I know, there hasn't been any money put towards an extension yet, I don't think? There was a request to NCTCOG earlier this year for $1mil for a study, but I don't know what the status of that is.

Yeah, that study was funded and all parties are in agreement that they will move the Knox extension along as funding can be gathered for it. MATA wants it, the city wants it and the NTCOG will contribute to its funding as well.

[lakewoodhobo]

Progress on ex-Toronto PCC #4614 per MATA's Facebook page.

[Cbdallas]

Does anyone know what happened to EMMA I have not seen her run in a long while.

[northsouth]

I vaguely recall hearing it had some electrical component fail a few months ago, can't remember where or when though. I'm just glad they're back to having enough operable cars to run three in regular service, instead of just two like they did for a while.

[Haretip]

New track construction to connect new carban space in the M-Line tower. (Photo from MATA facebook).

[joshua.dodd]

Does anyone know what happened to EMMA I have not seen her run in a long while.

Emma's sitting in the barn. She often has trouble when she goes into service. Nothing has been done with her yet as workers are working on the ex Toronto car at the moment.

[joshua.dodd]

I vaguely recall hearing it had some electrical component fail a few months ago, can't remember where or when though. I'm just glad they're back to having enough operable cars to run three in regular service, instead of just two like they did for a while.

They will be running three cars by January. So far they have only been running two.

[cowboyeagle05]

Someone needs to make an identification card for the trolley cars. I've been on this forum since middle school and I still don't know the name of the streetcars matched with their appearance and or number. I think the only two I knew for a while was the Green Dragon and Rosie.

The new MATA website has this page now but no pictures...http://mata.org/cars/ Emma isnt even listed on there and I would love to be able to follow things a little easier when they do a social media post about a car every now and then.

[Tivo_Kenevil]

Don't they have their names on them?

[cowboyeagle05]

Some do yes. If you google a few they show up like Rosie and the Green Dragon but since the names are pretty commonplace on the forum on this thread I would appreciate a cheat sheet for referencing when some of you go back and forth like everyone is in on the joke. Like what the name of the metal one the most contemporary one they have been using? I think it's from Belgium or something.

[Haretip]

The metal contemporary car is Emma or 7169 and is from Belgium. Usually wrapped in a beer advertisement and currently not in service due to a faulty relay. Check this page for car pictures, numbers and names:

http://www.mata.org/aboutus.html

[Tivo_Kenevil]

I know the wrapping helps with cost. But that really kills the charm from these beautiful cars

[electricron]

Here’s their names with links to their photos.
The Crescent Rose or Rosie (Car 122)
http://mata.org/wp-content/uploads/2017 ... 60-674.jpg
The Green Dragon (Car 186)
http://www.uptowndallas.net/assets/UDI- ... rolley.jpg
Matilda (Car 369)
http://www.railpictures.net/images/d1/6 ... 331763.jpg
Putlina (Car 636)
http://www.jtbell.net/transit/images/Da ... Place2.jpg
Betty (Car 754)
http://www.sustainablecitynews.com/wp-c ... .21.23.jpg
Emma (Car 7169)
http://www.sustainablecitynews.com/wp-c ... G_1675.jpg
PCC from Toronto (Car 4614) Has it a name yet?
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DOJVNJJUMAAFBav.jpg

As for wrappings, only the steel body cars have them that i'm aware of, and that leaves just Emma as being wrapped today. The PCC car will have a steel body, so it will probably get wrapped soon after it's running on the line. Vinyl wrappings don't stick to wood well, thankfully.

[northsouth]

PCC from Toronto (Car 4614) Has it a name yet?

From an old comment on the MATA Facebook page, " 612 will be named Margaret, after Margaret Crow, for Trammell Crow's gracious funding support in 612's rebuild." Seems likely to me that they'll transfer the name to 4614.

So far they have only been running two.

Huh, a few weeks ago I checked the tracker and they had three cars running. Oh well.

[joshua.dodd]

Yeah, the third one was Emma. But she had a malfunction and has been in the barn. She should be running Friday.

[Cbdallas]

Can't wait to see here again and ride. I somehow never got to ride Emma never was in rotation when I was waiting at the stop.

[lakewoodhobo]

#4614 making its maiden voyage. Never thought I'd see the Toronto PCC restored.

Screen Shot 2018-11-28 at 11.19.12 AM.jpg

[tamtagon]

What's up with the extension to Knox?

[Tivo_Kenevil]

I wish modern street cars had better design. The PCC streetcars look so much better, I think because of the use of straight lines.. The modern streetcar in Dallas and in other cities, the Brookville Liberty model, look like Zingers Pastries.

[flyswatter]

That's one sweet looking car. Looks like a freaking tank too. How big is it compared to Matilda?

[cowboyeagle05]

Supposedly the ride is smoother on these PCC cars and it looks like the capacity for connecting lots of rider to Klyde Warren will be a lot better considering ever since the park opened MATA ridership has increased.

[Haretip]

369 Specs:
• Built: 1913
• Length: 47'10.4"
• Width: 7'6"
• Height: 10'5.6"
• Weight: 21 tons
• Motor: Four MV101 40-horsepower, 600-volt DC motors (

4614
• Built: 1951
• Length: 46'6"
• Width: 8'4"
• Height: 10'3"
• Weight: 19 tons
• Motor: Four WH 1432J 55 horsepower DC motors (220 total HP)

[lakewoodhobo]

Posted on the Park District Facebook page, although I'm sure the photo came from MATA.

[LongonBigD]

I am digging those white sidewalls!

[Cbdallas]

Have not been inside yet but have seen it on the go and it is a beauty. We need more of these and the extension to Knox.

[dfwcre8tive]

Have not been inside yet but have seen it on the go and it is a beauty. We need more of these and the extension to Knox.

And need some double-ended cars painted in the Dallas PCC livery (like this one in San Francisco that I see nearly every day).

[art_suckz]

My god... I've been waiting for this for soooo long. This makes me happier than D2... cotton belt, platform extensions, 3 car DART trains and the Modern streetcar combined. The only thing I'd get more excited about is the DAL-HOU Shinkansen.

[Tivo_Kenevil]

What is up with the Mats extension?

[cowboyeagle05]

Its probably tied in with delays on the Knox Complete street project. I think the Trolley extension would be a part of the conversion project of converting Cole and Mckinney to two-way streets which was only recently approved for some funding. Please though anyone feel free to correct me where I am wrong.

[lakewoodhobo]

Seen today. Wow, this thing is massive.

IMG_6255.jpg

[Cbdallas]

I am loving this new car and the extra capacity it adds to the system. Hope to some day see this car cross Knox street with the expansion.

[cowboyeagle05]

These new old cars are great for making MATA a more useful transportation system for Uptown. The smaller cars were cute and a great love but these new old metal streetcars will add capacity and still hold the historical attractiveness that MATA has been able to capitalize on.

[dzh]

Just a fun thing, no real update or news:

By the Trader Joe’s on Cole, they’re tearing up the street and you can see the old streetcar rails. What I would give to see streetcars on that part of Cole lol

[cowboyeagle05]

^Well its in the plans to bring it that far eventually. MATA and the city want to go to Knox.

[dfwcre8tive]

Six ex-Dallas PCC cars are available for sale by the Seashore Trolley Museum.

https://trolleymuseum.org/wp-content/up ... ochure.pdf

[Cbdallas]

Somebody get out there checkbook and lets get these and expand our system. How cool to have original Dallas cars on our lines again. If I win Powerball tomorrow night I am doing this!

[northsouth]

They actually did buy an old Dallas PCC in 2009. After sitting in temporary storage at the Illinois Railway Museum for a few years, they finally got it down here to start restoring it, only to find that the decades of winter road salt it had dealt with in Boston had caused extensive underframe damage. It was decided it was too far gone to restore, so they had to scrap it and moved on to restore one of the two ex-Toronto cars they bought in the mid-90s that had been sitting around over at the DART yard since then, and successfully restored it to service as car 4614 Margaret.

While I understand why they made the decision they did, I still really wish we had one of the Dallas PCCs restored and running down here. If I won the lottery, my ultimate plan would be start a whole Electric Railway Museum of Texas. I'd get a bunch of the Dallas PCCs, maybe get the 400-series car that went directly from Dallas Railway & Terminal Co. to the Seashore Trolley Museum, get the two surviving Texas Electric Railway locomotives, get the TE interurban that someone restored but converted to diesel and convert it back to electric, track down any other survivors of Texas based traction that survived but needs a good/better home, take a few of DART's cars when they get retired, and if they didn't get scrapped of the locomotives that TXU used at their two East Texas powerplants that private electrified trackage to move coal from the mines/other railways to the plants.

[MC_ScattCat]

I spoke with someone on the council running for reelection the other night. Apparently DART is in the early works of working on a way to fund/plan connecting the the streetcar system through downtown.

My personal opinion is they need two streetcar lines. One Trinity Groves/Sylvan 30 area to Lowest Greenville and one from The Zoo up through Bishop Arts, Uptown to Knox. Both would go through downtown and complement the DART lines and busses. Also, most of the new apartments and entertainment areas (minus Deep Ellum) would be easily reached without using a car in these congested and hard to park areas.

[R1070]

East Quarter/Farmers Market through Deep Ellum would be a great connection as well.

Eventually seeing something connect Oak Lawn would be awesome.